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Old 12-07-2007, 01:31 PM
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Default Same Duty D/H turn time

Now that the company is scheduling more and more same duty deadheads, I have a question.

The minimum time between block-in from the revenue trip and departure of the deadhead is 1+30 (CBA Section 25, Appendix A), which is pretty agressive, IMO.

What happens if the inbound revenue flight is late, and cuts into the 1:30? Do I call scheduling and tell them that the pairing has to be rebuilt due to having an illegal turn?

I have a 2+22 turn in ATL to the scheduled deadhead (the last one of the night to MEM). Am I right in assuming that if we're 52 minutes late, the company is going to have to (on paper) lay me over in ATL to get me on the first flight out in the morning?
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Old 12-07-2007, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Sluggo_63 View Post

I have a 2+22 turn in ATL to the scheduled deadhead (the last one of the night to MEM). Am I right in assuming that if we're 52 minutes late, the company is going to have to (on paper) lay me over in ATL to get me on the first flight out in the morning?
Careful what you ask for ... could they rebuild the trip such that you now deadhead back to MEM on the airplane you just flew in? Maybe after a much longer turn in ATL? Lots of other ATL-MEM flight also?
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Old 12-07-2007, 01:49 PM
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If the inbound is late, and you proceed at a reasonable pace and then miss the DH, what's the big deal? To you I mean.
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Old 12-07-2007, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Sluggo_63 View Post
Now that the company is scheduling more and more same duty deadheads, I have a question.

The minimum time between block-in from the revenue trip and departure of the deadhead is 1+30 (CBA Section 25, Appendix A), which is pretty agressive, IMO.

What happens if the inbound revenue flight is late, and cuts into the 1:30? Do I call scheduling and tell them that the pairing has to be rebuilt due to having an illegal turn?

I have a 2+22 turn in ATL to the scheduled deadhead (the last one of the night to MEM). Am I right in assuming that if we're 52 minutes late, the company is going to have to (on paper) lay me over in ATL to get me on the first flight out in the morning?
Good Question!! Have you talked to Contract Admin and what did they say?? (of course CA usually doesn't seem to side with us no matter what the CBA says...."company has done this in the past", "pilot Q&A Book???",etc., etc.)
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Old 12-07-2007, 02:26 PM
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The key word is "scheduled", like everything else around here.

Doesn't have to be realistic, just scheduled.

But If you don't deviate and miss a DH, they still have to take care of you.
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Old 12-07-2007, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Sluggo_63 View Post
Now that the company is scheduling more and more same duty deadheads, I have a question.

The minimum time between block-in from the revenue trip and departure of the deadhead is 1+30 (CBA Section 25, Appendix A), which is pretty agressive, IMO.

What happens if the inbound revenue flight is late, and cuts into the 1:30? Do I call scheduling and tell them that the pairing has to be rebuilt due to having an illegal turn?

I have a 2+22 turn in ATL to the scheduled deadhead (the last one of the night to MEM). Am I right in assuming that if we're 52 minutes late, the company is going to have to (on paper) lay me over in ATL to get me on the first flight out in the morning?
That appendix concerns SIG parameters and scheduled, not operational. It is echoed in 12.B.1.d.i. In your example, the scheduled trip meets the parameters. Operationally, you are going to revert back to the duty limits in Section 12.
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Old 12-07-2007, 02:39 PM
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Don't let them put you back on the company jet. Have them get you a hotel and then take the next flight after a legal rest period. You are on the clock!
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Old 12-07-2007, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by angry tanker View Post
Don't let them put you back on the company jet. Have them get you a hotel and then take the next flight after a legal rest period. You are on the clock!
This is what I was getting at. I am planning on deviating, but not until I see whether or not I'm late. What I looking to see is if we're late, and don't have time to get from the cargo side of the ATL ramp to the commercial side, get through security, and board the airplane, will scheduling cut a new pairing with me now legal resting in ATL, with a d/h the next day, with the resulting increase in pay?
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Old 12-07-2007, 03:57 PM
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I think the answer is maybe. Is everyone in the pairing deviating? If so they may not rebuild the pairing.

Don't forget you have the back end deviation 8 hour cut off.
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Old 12-07-2007, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Sluggo_63 View Post
This is what I was getting at. I am planning on deviating, but not until I see whether or not I'm late. What I looking to see is if we're late, and don't have time to get from the cargo side of the ATL ramp to the commercial side, get through security, and board the airplane, will scheduling cut a new pairing with me now legal resting in ATL, with a d/h the next day, with the resulting increase in pay?
If any crew member is NOT deviating, they are obliged to rebuild the prg. Otherwise, you're SOL, at least last I heard from Contract Admin.
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