ANA + UPS 'codeshare'?
10-29-2008, 06:30 PM
#21
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 65
Originally Posted by Sideshow Bob
I guess useless picketing got boring...
I am a DHL pilot that will probably be out of a job soon. I like to come to this site to see what is going on in the industry not to read whining or bickering posts. I am sure most of us feel the same way.
AP
10-29-2008, 07:07 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: MD11 CPT
Posts: 1,077
Originally Posted by A Pilot
Picketing never gets boring and I don't think it's useless. Whining on the other hand, is boring and useless. I am also sick of reading whining posts on every thread that has anything to do with DHL or UPS. I (we) hear enough whining in the cockpits and crew rooms.
I am a DHL pilot that will probably be out of a job soon. I like to come to this site to see what is going on in the industry not to read whining or bickering posts. I am sure most of us feel the same way.
AP
I am a DHL pilot that will probably be out of a job soon. I like to come to this site to see what is going on in the industry not to read whining or bickering posts. I am sure most of us feel the same way.
AP
10-29-2008, 07:37 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 157
Picketing
[quote=A Pilot;488505]Picketing never gets boring and I don't think it's useless.
In 9 years at an ALPA carrier I went to one picket. I was very new and VERY wet behing the ears. I jumpseated to Herndon, VA on days off, put myself up in a ratty, but expensive hotal just so I could attend an ALPA picket for a cause I thought worthy. Arrived at ALPA offices at O'dark-thirty and saw about 15 picket signs and 25 guys in the lobby. I looked around waiting to find 1000 of my ALPA brother/sisters ready for a healthy rally. But it was not to be. We marched around the D**n building in snow and sub-zero temps. The only people who saw our "rally" were office workers outside on smoke-break. Whole thing was over in 15 minutes. However, I did notice that Duane Worthless got his photo taken probably 100 times with a picket sign and shoulder-to-shoulder with other uniformed ALPA crewmembers.
In the end, I came to the sad realization that I had just wasted two days of my life and a big chunk of first-year pay on a hotel room just for a Duane Worthless PR stunt.
I puked the whole way home. Such was the beginning of my 9 years of disgruntlement (sp?) with ALPA.
Rott
In 9 years at an ALPA carrier I went to one picket. I was very new and VERY wet behing the ears. I jumpseated to Herndon, VA on days off, put myself up in a ratty, but expensive hotal just so I could attend an ALPA picket for a cause I thought worthy. Arrived at ALPA offices at O'dark-thirty and saw about 15 picket signs and 25 guys in the lobby. I looked around waiting to find 1000 of my ALPA brother/sisters ready for a healthy rally. But it was not to be. We marched around the D**n building in snow and sub-zero temps. The only people who saw our "rally" were office workers outside on smoke-break. Whole thing was over in 15 minutes. However, I did notice that Duane Worthless got his photo taken probably 100 times with a picket sign and shoulder-to-shoulder with other uniformed ALPA crewmembers.
In the end, I came to the sad realization that I had just wasted two days of my life and a big chunk of first-year pay on a hotel room just for a Duane Worthless PR stunt.
I puked the whole way home. Such was the beginning of my 9 years of disgruntlement (sp?) with ALPA.
Rott
10-30-2008, 04:18 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 137
Originally Posted by Slice
Don't play coy with me. Most of us on here from UPS have tried to be supportive of what may be happening to you guys at DHL. Yet, you come on here and whine and try and start crap constantly. It's getting old.
As far as stuff getting old, the schadenfreude being exhibited by you guys has been overbearing. Now that the shoe is on the other foot you find it offensive?
10-30-2008, 05:01 AM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: DC-8 756/767
Posts: 1,144
If you read the story, you might see that UPS will do some work for them, and they will do some work for us. Sounds like good business to me. I guess we will find out what the union has to say about it and what the details are gonna be.
Oh, and I don't the the shoe is on the other foot just yet. The devil will be in the detail, and details we do not have. I know misery loves company, but try not to sound so excited.
Oh, and I don't the the shoe is on the other foot just yet. The devil will be in the detail, and details we do not have. I know misery loves company, but try not to sound so excited.
10-30-2008, 07:09 AM
#26
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 65
Originally Posted by Sideshow Bob
The picketing didn't save anybody's job, so apparently it was useless. And make no mistake, UPS filmed everyone on that line like they filmed us on the picket lines in '97, so when we do interview again it will be less than useless. As for the conversation not being high brow enough for you, if you don't like it move on...nobody's forcing you to click on anything.
The DHL/UPS agreement isn't finalized yet. If the deal falls apart, many will argue the picketing had nothing to do with it, but others could argue the picketing events created a lot of media attention that may have helped obtain the hearings, etc. Just like when FedEx obtained their contract, many of those guys would say the picketing helped. IPA didnt do any informational picketing (I don't think) and they got a great contract. So one could argue either way whether informational picketing is effective or not. Of course, we would all prefer the right to go on strike, so we wouldnt need to bother with that.
As for UPS interviewing again and not hiring the ASTAR pilots because they they have photos of us, are you serious? Oh, I know they have camaras and filmed the event, they probably won't hire any ABX or ASTAR pilot anyway because that seems to be their policy. I have said on this board before that UPS did not hire or even interview one Challenge Air or Emory pilot after taking over that flying. I could be wrong about that but I know people that were at both of those companies and thats what they say. If you UPS pilots know of any former Challenge Air or Emory pilots than ok, tell us what a mistake that was.
Just to beat this dead horse a little more, I will say the Astar pilots were picketing UPS headquarters not IPA pilots. We don't blame you pilots at all we really don't blame your company either. We picketed UPS because they are a decent company that is concerned about their image and this deal would cause the loss of our jobs. DHL on the other hand could care less about their image. We know picketing UPS headquarters was not the classiest thing to do, but keep in mind we are fighting for our jobs. If we were fighting for a pay raise that would be different. So, in this case the tactic was appropriate for the desparate circumstances. And if it were FedEx we would have done the same thing.
I know if IPA ever faces a threat like this they will pull out all the stops, at least I would hope they would.
Ok, back to this thread, the UPS/ANA looks like it would be neither a loss nor a gain in flying on the surface.
And Bob your right I don't have to click here, but then I would miss this fun.
10-30-2008, 08:43 AM
#28
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 358
Originally Posted by Biggs
OK if you want to know what's going on call the union. So I did and here's what the IPA is saying.
1. As of 1100am EST today members of the EB are meeting with UPS about the ANA deal and discussing implementation. If the meeting ends soon enough to write a report, it will be on the IPNN today, if not then tomorrow. UPS called yesterday and set up the meeting. So the IPA got about just as much notice as we did, reading it in the press. I prject if fruloghes happen it will be the same way, it seems to be UPS's MO.
1. As of 1100am EST today members of the EB are meeting with UPS about the ANA deal and discussing implementation. If the meeting ends soon enough to write a report, it will be on the IPNN today, if not then tomorrow. UPS called yesterday and set up the meeting. So the IPA got about just as much notice as we did, reading it in the press. I prject if fruloghes happen it will be the same way, it seems to be UPS's MO.
You must be kidding, right. Half the time I don't think they know and most of the other time they don't even care.
10-30-2008, 09:14 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: MD11 CPT
Posts: 1,077
Originally Posted by A Pilot
Bob,
The DHL/UPS agreement isn't finalized yet. If the deal falls apart, many will argue the picketing had nothing to do with it, but others could argue the picketing events created a lot of media attention that may have helped obtain the hearings, etc. Just like when FedEx obtained their contract, many of those guys would say the picketing helped. IPA didnt do any informational picketing (I don't think) and they got a great contract. So one could argue either way whether informational picketing is effective or not. Of course, we would all prefer the right to go on strike, so we wouldnt need to bother with that.
As for UPS interviewing again and not hiring the ASTAR pilots because they they have photos of us, are you serious? Oh, I know they have camaras and filmed the event, they probably won't hire any ABX or ASTAR pilot anyway because that seems to be their policy. I have said on this board before that UPS did not hire or even interview one Challenge Air or Emory pilot after taking over that flying. I could be wrong about that but I know people that were at both of those companies and thats what they say. If you UPS pilots know of any former Challenge Air or Emory pilots than ok, tell us what a mistake that was.
Just to beat this dead horse a little more, I will say the Astar pilots were picketing UPS headquarters not IPA pilots. We don't blame you pilots at all we really don't blame your company either. We picketed UPS because they are a decent company that is concerned about their image and this deal would cause the loss of our jobs. DHL on the other hand could care less about their image. We know picketing UPS headquarters was not the classiest thing to do, but keep in mind we are fighting for our jobs. If we were fighting for a pay raise that would be different. So, in this case the tactic was appropriate for the desparate circumstances. And if it were FedEx we would have done the same thing.
I know if IPA ever faces a threat like this they will pull out all the stops, at least I would hope they would.
Ok, back to this thread, the UPS/ANA looks like it would be neither a loss nor a gain in flying on the surface.
And Bob your right I don't have to click here, but then I would miss this fun.
The DHL/UPS agreement isn't finalized yet. If the deal falls apart, many will argue the picketing had nothing to do with it, but others could argue the picketing events created a lot of media attention that may have helped obtain the hearings, etc. Just like when FedEx obtained their contract, many of those guys would say the picketing helped. IPA didnt do any informational picketing (I don't think) and they got a great contract. So one could argue either way whether informational picketing is effective or not. Of course, we would all prefer the right to go on strike, so we wouldnt need to bother with that.
As for UPS interviewing again and not hiring the ASTAR pilots because they they have photos of us, are you serious? Oh, I know they have camaras and filmed the event, they probably won't hire any ABX or ASTAR pilot anyway because that seems to be their policy. I have said on this board before that UPS did not hire or even interview one Challenge Air or Emory pilot after taking over that flying. I could be wrong about that but I know people that were at both of those companies and thats what they say. If you UPS pilots know of any former Challenge Air or Emory pilots than ok, tell us what a mistake that was.
Just to beat this dead horse a little more, I will say the Astar pilots were picketing UPS headquarters not IPA pilots. We don't blame you pilots at all we really don't blame your company either. We picketed UPS because they are a decent company that is concerned about their image and this deal would cause the loss of our jobs. DHL on the other hand could care less about their image. We know picketing UPS headquarters was not the classiest thing to do, but keep in mind we are fighting for our jobs. If we were fighting for a pay raise that would be different. So, in this case the tactic was appropriate for the desparate circumstances. And if it were FedEx we would have done the same thing.
I know if IPA ever faces a threat like this they will pull out all the stops, at least I would hope they would.
Ok, back to this thread, the UPS/ANA looks like it would be neither a loss nor a gain in flying on the surface.
And Bob your right I don't have to click here, but then I would miss this fun.
. But they also get tasked with monitoring and interceding in anything they view as a threat to their operation. They were filming us on the Teamsters picket lines in the hope that one of us would do something stupid that they could use in the media or as leverage in the future. Like much of the pilot management here, they are always running around trying to justify their existence to their higher ups and/or shine the light of dedication upon themselves as they have no union protection...very dog eat dog environment.You guys dared [tic] to deface the Kremlin, and believe me it ****ed them off. It didn't deter them from the deal, if anything it steeled their resolve as they often act as much out of spite as greed. While it may have made you feel better, if the deal doesn't go through I don't think zee Germans were simply going to go back to business as usual, and with the acceleration of the economic woes they may well just cede the entire NA market to us and Fred. If anything, you guys should have picketed DHL and Capitol Hill, as you had nothing to lose and everything to gain since they are the real players in the deal. And answer me this...if Fed Ex got the deal would you have picketed Fed Ex?
10-30-2008, 09:55 AM
#30
Retired Doug herder
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: Former DC8 73 Capt DHLAirways/Astar. Retired
Posts: 424
Sideshow,
Why you think we'd care if we burned a bridge or not is beyond me, since we don't. And if it had been FedEx instead of you guys, absolutely we would have picketed in MEM. And I'll wager that the FedEx guys would have brought us out some BBQ. They also would have had the sense to realize that we were picketing the company, not their pilot group. Not saying it's the way you look at it, but there were enough on this board expressing disgust at our actions, and glee at the projected windfall, that to act surprised or chagrined that some might take a dig at Brown guys after all of that is beyond any rational thought. Just a question. Are you guys going to participate in the informational picketing in SDF that your mechanics are going to put on soon?
Why you think we'd care if we burned a bridge or not is beyond me, since we don't. And if it had been FedEx instead of you guys, absolutely we would have picketed in MEM. And I'll wager that the FedEx guys would have brought us out some BBQ. They also would have had the sense to realize that we were picketing the company, not their pilot group. Not saying it's the way you look at it, but there were enough on this board expressing disgust at our actions, and glee at the projected windfall, that to act surprised or chagrined that some might take a dig at Brown guys after all of that is beyond any rational thought. Just a question. Are you guys going to participate in the informational picketing in SDF that your mechanics are going to put on soon?
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