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FDX Hong Kong FDA feedback/pitfalls

Old 04-03-2010, 12:34 PM
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Default FDX Hong Kong FDA feedback/pitfalls

Any HKG based FDX guys on here care to post a few details as to what it truly costs to live over there? Is it commutable if you are senior? How does the tax equalization work? Do you still get the firlst $90K (approx) free of Fed tax? How did the move package work?

Just some of the q's I had. Any other info would be great. Looks like another HKG bid on the horizon.

Thanks.
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Old 04-03-2010, 12:52 PM
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As far as the tax break, we gave that up with the LOA.
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Old 04-03-2010, 01:58 PM
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I also wouldn't recommend taking the move package and then planning to commute--it goes against the LOA and could set yourself up for termination. I know there are guys who do it but I wouldn't want to live my life looking over my shoulder. And yes, the LOA is woefully inadequate.
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Old 04-03-2010, 02:17 PM
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Having been there a bit, do you HKG guys regret bidding it? Will you return as soon as you are able to without penalty? I've heard that people are generally happy there. That wouldn't make it to APC. Let us know what you think, those that are actually there. How painful is the commute? Thanks!
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Old 04-03-2010, 04:11 PM
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I'm interested in this feedback also. If you guys would let us know how the commute is that would be most helpful.
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Old 04-03-2010, 05:57 PM
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Default Move package

I wouldn't take the "buy my house" move package, but as I read the LOA, the company will give you $10K up front and $2700/month for an apartment over there. I am just saying if you are in the top 10% you could easily work a 16 on/28 off schedule, staggered with vacation every 4 months. Basically you would be looking at 7 round trips on AA coach to HKG at $1200/RT. What you do on your days off is nobody's biz. The LOA doesn't say I have to live there 30 days a month, just live there. Not too bad when you think about it.

Now, as far as the tax situation, I think you still get the first $130K tax free, just the rest is taxed as though you are in the states. Correct me if I am wrong but if you have an address over there, you are still an EXPAT working abroad, LOA or not.

Chime in here, let's have some info flowing so those that may bid this upcoming HKG can learn BEFORE living it!
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Old 04-03-2010, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by 990Convair View Post
I wouldn't take the "buy my house" move package, but as I read the LOA, the company will give you $10K up front and $2700/month for an apartment over there. I am just saying if you are in the top 10% you could easily work a 16 on/28 off schedule, staggered with vacation every 4 months. Basically you would be looking at 7 round trips on AA coach to HKG at $1200/RT. What you do on your days off is nobody's biz. The LOA doesn't say I have to live there 30 days a month, just live there. Not too bad when you think about it.

Now, as far as the tax situation, I think you still get the first $130K tax free, just the rest is taxed as though you are in the states. Correct me if I am wrong but if you have an address over there, you are still an EXPAT working abroad, LOA or not.

Chime in here, let's have some info flowing so those that may bid this upcoming HKG can learn BEFORE living it!
Ok... I'll chime in a little... all you ever hear about HKG are the negatives on this forum, so I hope I can give a little positive spin;-)

RE: regret bidding HKG? No. For me it has worked out great! And in general, talking to the other pilots out here, most are happy to be here.

Yes, you do get 10000$ seed money and yes you can live within the 2700.00 allowance, but it won't buy you much. And...unfortunately as the economy has gotten better, the rents have and are rising. I know of many though that pay more than their allowance, but for myself and some others we don't have to cough up anything out of pocket. Depends on where you want to live?

About commuting... I agree with the "what you do on your days off is your business" attitude, and if you are senior enough to bid as such could fairly easily commute. If you buy tickets long enough in advance you can find some good deals on line on RT tix...Nuff said about that!

As far as the Tax equalization goes... Expect to pay what you would pay back home in the states. If you live in a state with no state income tax then you pay no state income tax, if you live in a state with state income tax, then you pay the state income tax. But for sure you will pay whatever your federal income tax is. No more no less. You don't get any expat exclusion, allowance, etc. The Co. gets that. We did give that away in the LOA. Personally I don't have any heartburn with that, I just think it can be a pain in the @#$ sometimes dealing w/ PWC... as it can be with any middle man?

If you come out here with an open mind and a good attitude, you will enjoy it. The flying is fairly easy, the layovers are nice, and if you wanna explore Asia then this is a good place to start from. In general though, I think most of us out here are pretty happy that we came here. Hope this helps
Z
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Old 04-03-2010, 06:59 PM
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Z,

Thanks for the intel, very much appreciated.
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Old 04-03-2010, 11:27 PM
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I'm guessing anyone that thinks people are generally happy out here has not attended either of the last 2 union meetings. Some are happier than others. A formerly quick upgrade from FO to Captain certainly helps things. Here are some of my thoughts, as someone who did not receive a pay raise to be here:

Some issues we face:
  • Ground trans is not just seriously unpleasant, it's downright unsafe. There have been 3 reported accidents. It is gradually being used less and less as each bid pack is printed, though sadly I believe it will take a fatality for it to be totally removed as an option for the company. (including for reserve pilot and "operationally necessity")
  • 2700 is woefully inadequate for housing, let alone when coupled with the costs of tuition and general living expenses. Go to Schnucks and buy a weeks worth of groceries. Then do it in HK. You'll be seriously surprised (not that a weeks' worth of groceries would fit in your fridge here anyway). Interested in living in a apartment building aptly nicknamed "the dorms" as a middle aged male?
  • Pairings are nothing special. Think week long trips with 16 hour layovers and night hub turns in CAN. Most are now double DH's (see GT comment above). However, a commercial airline deadhead from HKG to CAN isn't terribly helpful bank-wise or all that pleasant to actually sit through either.
  • Be wary when you think you'll just be here for two years. Yes, the LOA specifies a 2 year commitment when one takes the "enhanced" option (the 10K + 2700/mo). However, there has to be a bid and a vacancy that you are able to hold to get out of here. You and your family want to breathe this air for 5 years? Google "Hong Kong pollution". Read it. Then Google "Guangzhou pollution". Read it. Goes from "bad" to "holy **** are you ******* kidding me??!"
  • Yes, as stated above, no one has any say where you spend your vacation days/sick days/and days off. This isn't North Korea, East Berlin, or Commie Russia. Passport audits to determine where you spend your free time are not part of the LOA.
My 2C
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Old 04-04-2010, 02:17 AM
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Overall, I'm happy but.......

The housing allowance is grossly and severely inadequate. Yeah, I know the typical response: "Well, in Memphis nobody pays for my house, why should yours get paid for?" The majority of us are still carrying our stateside mortgage in addition to money out of pocket in HKG. We also need some help with education expenses. We got sold a bill of goods on this one. My garage in the states is bigger than my apartment in HKG.

If you plan to get the $10K seed, housing allowance, commute and not move your family out BE CAREFUL. This can get you in A LOT of hot water. I have heard one pilot is being forced to pay his back. Others are getting regularly harrassed because their wife hasn't moved out, one kid stayed stateside, etc.. The company is serious about this and before its all over someone is going to get fired.

It made financial sense when 4a2b showed up but with BLGs moving back towards normal I don't see the financial benefit (unless you are on the panel). My opinion is most of the takers are already here. I don't think the MD11 base will fill (right seat) without some more $ for housing and bone thrown in for education.

Having said all that, read z's post read skypine's post. Both make very valid points. I like Hong Kong and plan to stay for a while. Its fun but not exactly financially rewarding.

Anyway, my .02
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