FedEx TA reached
01-30-2011, 09:21 AM
#112
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 556
Originally Posted by MD10PLT
Something interesting in the FedEx response to the new crew rest rules. The FAA proposes leaving the ULR rules up to each airline and the contract with their pilots. FedEx is proposing a 20 hour duty day for ULR flying, provided you are given 48 hours off.
So basically if FedEx can influence the FAA, they get ULR flying rules without negotiating with their pilots. So of course the company wants to wait until the ruling to have a contract. It eliminates this as an issue.
So basically if FedEx can influence the FAA, they get ULR flying rules without negotiating with their pilots. So of course the company wants to wait until the ruling to have a contract. It eliminates this as an issue.
Unless of course, UL flights, have been authorized in the new TA.
Which leads me to the final point of this post, we have a process, conjecture and speculation, while fun
, are pointless until we receive an approved TA from ALPA to actually read,digest and vote on.I look forward to seeing what is in play and will make my personal judgment with my vote, if it comes to that.
01-30-2011, 09:37 AM
#113
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: B777 Captain
Posts: 566
Originally Posted by KnightFlyer
That's funny; my contract has the top WB Capt rate at $262.84 for the ULR a/c. Whoops sorry, "deflated" down to $245.65.
01-30-2011, 10:00 AM
#114
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: MD11 F/O
Posts: 653
[QUOTE=Sniper;938745] Getting COLA while negotiating for the typical years it takes to get a new CBA would be great for not only the FedEx pilots, but for all pilot groups who lose out to the CPI every time their contract becomes amendable.
If most guys are thinking like this, then we are doomed. We will give up every ounce of leverage to get 3% now.(which we would get as a signing bonus later anyway). I would liken it to interest base bargaining(smoke) and cost neutral(mirrors). I don't think you could set the bar any lower and I don't think our team has. We'll see next week!
If most guys are thinking like this, then we are doomed. We will give up every ounce of leverage to get 3% now.(which we would get as a signing bonus later anyway). I would liken it to interest base bargaining(smoke) and cost neutral(mirrors). I don't think you could set the bar any lower and I don't think our team has. We'll see next week!
01-30-2011, 10:12 AM
#115
New Hire
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: A300 Capt
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by FXDX
I have to agree with Johnny Viper too. The union specifically refused to put out bullet points or explanations on the contract convinced that if they did that is all the crew force would read.
So you are left with only the tangled legalese to plow through and try to comprehend. That didn't work out so well in a lot of areas.
It would be nice if the MEC would see fit to provide explanations and clarifications of major issues as well as the contract itself instead of simply bleating out read the contract!
So you are left with only the tangled legalese to plow through and try to comprehend. That didn't work out so well in a lot of areas.
It would be nice if the MEC would see fit to provide explanations and clarifications of major issues as well as the contract itself instead of simply bleating out read the contract!
01-30-2011, 12:21 PM
#117
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Position: B-777
Posts: 177
I've only been here 6 years but...
It seems to me that we have honestly had pretty good luck negotiating contracts as it pertains to the economy. Every time we negotiate the economy has been in a growth or recovery mode (for the most part). That allows us a little leverage.
I am concerned that if we have a 2 year deal we could be on the opposite side of things (since it could be 4 before a new contract). We could be in a position of negotiating in a down economy and thus in concessionary bargaining mode.
Thoughts? Am I way off on this?
It seems to me that we have honestly had pretty good luck negotiating contracts as it pertains to the economy. Every time we negotiate the economy has been in a growth or recovery mode (for the most part). That allows us a little leverage.
I am concerned that if we have a 2 year deal we could be on the opposite side of things (since it could be 4 before a new contract). We could be in a position of negotiating in a down economy and thus in concessionary bargaining mode.
Thoughts? Am I way off on this?
01-30-2011, 01:18 PM
#118
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: B777 Captain
Posts: 566
Originally Posted by HumptyDumpty
I've only been here 6 years but...
It seems to me that we have honestly had pretty good luck negotiating contracts as it pertains to the economy. Every time we negotiate the economy has been in a growth or recovery mode (for the most part). That allows us a little leverage.
I am concerned that if we have a 2 year deal we could be on the opposite side of things (since it could be 4 before a new contract). We could be in a position of negotiating in a down economy and thus in concessionary bargaining mode.
Thoughts? Am I way off on this?
It seems to me that we have honestly had pretty good luck negotiating contracts as it pertains to the economy. Every time we negotiate the economy has been in a growth or recovery mode (for the most part). That allows us a little leverage.
I am concerned that if we have a 2 year deal we could be on the opposite side of things (since it could be 4 before a new contract). We could be in a position of negotiating in a down economy and thus in concessionary bargaining mode.
Thoughts? Am I way off on this?
01-30-2011, 01:32 PM
#119
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 2,418
Thoughts in no apparent order.
Union chose not to produce a FAQ guide because some of the verbiage, common language from the one produced for our first contract bit us a time or two in various grievances. Whether that was the correct path to choose is arguable. What isn't refutable, is that the vast majority of FedEx pilots choose not to read the contract. To the extent of being unaware that there are things that we can file pay-logs for and request the extra compensation provided in the disruption section of the contract. OR, the fact that a great many of the pilots I fly with are unaware that if they are on a published NOCAT pairing, they are entitled to 25$ compensation, P.F.D, as long as they submit it on their expense report.
From what I understand, the TA verbal agreement came pretty late Thursday. RUMOR control is why the Union announced one had been reached. (Numerous time's I've read complaints that we heard things from the company before we heard anything from the Union). Now the lawyers have time to create some semi-readable lawyerese before any pdf files are created....and the process is simple. NC presents it to the MEC, MEC votes on whether to kick it back or submit it to US for ratification. If you want to be one of the first people to read it, sign up for the NC. Next in line, sign up for the MEC. Third in line is US. Assuming the TA is all it's advertised to be, I expect to get an email from the Union with the TA attached to it sometime the week of the 7th.
As I understand it, P2P is intended to assist the MEC in communicating. Right now I'd be very surprised if the MEC has anything more to communicate about the TA than what we've already read in the emails. The last thing I'd like is for the MEC to act like Congress last year and vote for the TA without reading it.
While I have no insider knowledge, I will predict that the raise is less than some of us would like and greater than some in the company would like us to get. I will predict that there will be some angry voices on APC about us giving up our leverage for this minimal improvement.
Take a look at our brothers flying other airlines. We're not in the glory days of regulation. Not in the glory days of United's industry leading contract. We've essentially become the leaders of the pack by default, and our A plan is still well funded.
As to leverage, we are not living in the glory days of unions. And FedEx has never been one of the strongest unions out there. Examples are easy to find and some we are all well aware of. Best examples are the 777 and disuputed pairings, anyone who thought our crew force wouldn't bid it just because the payrate wasn't settled was living in a dream world. And as for disputed pairings, we just can't seem to help ourselves in Memphis. There are enough people who only fly them once a year, or quarter, and justify to themselves as an honest mistake or my bad, whooops. Or, look at the guys in AOC talking with non-members.
The union membership is what it is. The legal environment is what it is. United went to court because their pilots weren't flying overtime and won. Other airlines have gone to court because their pilots have pointed out that perhaps you should reconsider flying marginally sick when you're about to be furloughed and have sick time available, and won. There are numerous legal settlements out there regarding "illegal" job actions that were lost by unions.
The NPRM could have a dramatic impact on how FedEx runs the flying schedule. Like it or not, the negotiations could have been dragging on for another year or two. Personally, I'd rather have the $$ sooner rather than later. And I kind of like the idea that we can essentially re-open negotiations once the new regs are published rather than have to wait another 3-4 years.
Given how FedEx negotiates and operates. To me seems like the bird in the had is better than the 1.2 birds in the bush.
But that's just me, if you want to let your mad get in the way of your money, knock yourself out
Union chose not to produce a FAQ guide because some of the verbiage, common language from the one produced for our first contract bit us a time or two in various grievances. Whether that was the correct path to choose is arguable. What isn't refutable, is that the vast majority of FedEx pilots choose not to read the contract. To the extent of being unaware that there are things that we can file pay-logs for and request the extra compensation provided in the disruption section of the contract. OR, the fact that a great many of the pilots I fly with are unaware that if they are on a published NOCAT pairing, they are entitled to 25$ compensation, P.F.D, as long as they submit it on their expense report.
From what I understand, the TA verbal agreement came pretty late Thursday. RUMOR control is why the Union announced one had been reached. (Numerous time's I've read complaints that we heard things from the company before we heard anything from the Union). Now the lawyers have time to create some semi-readable lawyerese before any pdf files are created....and the process is simple. NC presents it to the MEC, MEC votes on whether to kick it back or submit it to US for ratification. If you want to be one of the first people to read it, sign up for the NC. Next in line, sign up for the MEC. Third in line is US. Assuming the TA is all it's advertised to be, I expect to get an email from the Union with the TA attached to it sometime the week of the 7th.
As I understand it, P2P is intended to assist the MEC in communicating. Right now I'd be very surprised if the MEC has anything more to communicate about the TA than what we've already read in the emails. The last thing I'd like is for the MEC to act like Congress last year and vote for the TA without reading it.
While I have no insider knowledge, I will predict that the raise is less than some of us would like and greater than some in the company would like us to get. I will predict that there will be some angry voices on APC about us giving up our leverage for this minimal improvement.
Take a look at our brothers flying other airlines. We're not in the glory days of regulation. Not in the glory days of United's industry leading contract. We've essentially become the leaders of the pack by default, and our A plan is still well funded.
As to leverage, we are not living in the glory days of unions. And FedEx has never been one of the strongest unions out there. Examples are easy to find and some we are all well aware of. Best examples are the 777 and disuputed pairings, anyone who thought our crew force wouldn't bid it just because the payrate wasn't settled was living in a dream world. And as for disputed pairings, we just can't seem to help ourselves in Memphis. There are enough people who only fly them once a year, or quarter, and justify to themselves as an honest mistake or my bad, whooops. Or, look at the guys in AOC talking with non-members.
The union membership is what it is. The legal environment is what it is. United went to court because their pilots weren't flying overtime and won. Other airlines have gone to court because their pilots have pointed out that perhaps you should reconsider flying marginally sick when you're about to be furloughed and have sick time available, and won. There are numerous legal settlements out there regarding "illegal" job actions that were lost by unions.
The NPRM could have a dramatic impact on how FedEx runs the flying schedule. Like it or not, the negotiations could have been dragging on for another year or two. Personally, I'd rather have the $$ sooner rather than later. And I kind of like the idea that we can essentially re-open negotiations once the new regs are published rather than have to wait another 3-4 years.
Given how FedEx negotiates and operates. To me seems like the bird in the had is better than the 1.2 birds in the bush.
But that's just me, if you want to let your mad get in the way of your money, knock yourself out
01-30-2011, 02:02 PM
#120
Banned
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 798
I'm not sure why the NPRM stuff is our problem. I get the impression that the NPRM is going to increase operating costs (not nearly to the degree that the company claims, though). Does anyone remember when reserve rest rules were going to close all of the U.S. airlines?
In my opinion, the company wants to wait so that we can "share" in eating the increased operating costs. That philosophy should not be entertained at any cost.
PIPE
In my opinion, the company wants to wait so that we can "share" in eating the increased operating costs. That philosophy should not be entertained at any cost.
PIPE
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