That is very good news and impressive. Excellent news on the COBRA too.

But leading pay is good only if you are getting a paycheck instead of food stamps.

Not sure why you have to resort to insults.

I hope you are working on more furlough protection in contract talks. With hiring so sporadic it takes a professional a long time to secure protection from a furlough at UPS. So long that getting hired at Delta looks much more financially smart right now.

You've met the youngsters trying to get a job. I think it's fair warning to let them know the risks they are taking. Giving advice that may lead to a personal bankruptcy is not the right thing to do IMHO. Some have more than one mouth to feed.

When someone decides to leave their furlough job it is a leap of faith. Will I be furloughed again? Their furlough job will not be waiting if they suffer another one.


For the others -

Oh yes, there are draft *****s at Purple. Many of our group are independent contractors. The only thing keeping us from doing the same to our lowest 5% is 4a2b.

Arrogant? No. Probably just misunderstanding how things are going at Brown and somewhat gruff about it.

 

This leads me to what really chafes my hide.

An airline shouldn't ask you to give up your seniority number at another airline unless they offer some sort of commitment commensurate with that demand. They shouldn't furlough just to increase the CEO's bonus or increase the dividend.

So it's an understatement to say I'm not happy with UPS and will never recommend them as a good place to hang your hat.

 

Every CEO of a public company has that responsibility to increase the profit margin.

Furloughs happened due to unprecedented recession, age 60 changing and a few other factors I don't care to spell out right now.

I'd take out pilot group over any other. I'm no UPS apologist, but it's silly to be mad at the company. They simply don't care. It's a job and we are a number. When we add to the bottom line they may hire more. When we detract from it they will furlough. UPS made
Massive cuts company wide and the airline suffered on par with everyone else.

It's amazing to peak into the mindset of others!!

 

Some of our Furloughees went to Fedex and good on them. I hope they are in a better place and i highly doubt they would ever come back. There is no way I would tell them to come back. My buds at Fedex have a vastly better QOL. It would be insane to pass up an offer at Delta or AA right now to come here if we were hiring. Many of us near the bottom have played out the numbers with regard to going to a Legacy, especially those who still have numbers. The guys I know are watching it very closely. It seems for most that it is better to stay for now. There is no way we would ever vote in a 4a2b type of plan here for furlough protection. UPS would abuse the ***t out of it and we would never trust them to implement it properly. I tell all my bro's that want to come here that they better be careful what they ask for, it is not an airline. As to advice for the younger generation on furloughs, they happen no matter what you give to mgmt and they will always want more. Ask the guys at Eagle, AA, Xjet, and hopefully RAH about the risks of a furlough. They all have some cojones to vote NO to empty promises. As a former ACA guy my hat is off to them.

 

Good news no matter how disgruntled a pilot may be for whatever reason there is.

 

+1. Some of you guys would complain if you were hung with a new rope.

 

In addition to the unity on the OT/JA ban and COBRA assistance, we tried our version of 4a2b here. WE controlled the MOU however, not the company. The MOU offered the company about $135 Milion in concessions ranging from sicktime giveback to reduced schedules to voluntary leaves of absence. That amount was from a group of less than 2900 pilots. The company took the first few million prior to peak, and once they got through that they demanded even more to stop a furlough. We gave them more on a Friday, and they met us on the following Monday with a blind-side furlough and press release announcing it. They ended up saving around a little over $50 Million during the furlough...Too bad they didn't take what we offered up front.

Bottom line is that 4a2b wouldn't have saved our furloughees. This was the company's call and they bear the entire responsibility for the furlough. The IPA did everything in their power to prevent it without going down on their knees.

 

Well said.

It amuses me how many FDX guys break their own arms patting themselves on their own backs over a clause in their CBA that the union never thought would be necessary, and likely the company suggested for their own flexibility.

Yes...Fred has treated you far better than our bunch of boxheads and Gecko wannabees...

Yes...Fred has believed in profit growth via revenue and airplane growth...

Yes...FDX food, hotels and catering is better than UPS...

Yes...FDX make a shade more an hour than UPS, aside from the guarantee differential....

But...

FDX pilots have never actually had to "man up" when it came to a furlough (where IPA pilots stood up higher than ANY pilot group in history) or a strike (where IPA pilots stood up higher than ANY group in history).

These are no small or insignificant achievements even in the aura of Fred.

So, lets talk apples to apples if we're going to talk at all. The rest is chin music.

 

Hu??? I don't think anyone has argued with how well the IPA brotherhood handled themselves (except for the 10 low-lifes picking up OT). All I have read on here is a big congrats to you guys on the furloughs being called back, and to how well all you guys stood by in unity while they were without a check. And most of our guys on here have admitted that, most likely, we would not show anywhere near the same unity during a furlough as you did.

 

CloudSailor: I agree. The comments on here by you guys have been overwhelmingly positive, and are appreciated. I'm sure 99.9% of us would agree on that, and direct our angst to the company and not against anyone else. Thanks.