BYOB

UPS....no questions.

CactusCrew

If I were in my 30s, I'd leave my UPS job for your corporate job. But being a 2007 hire does have its affect on people.

You're young, do what will make you and your family happy.

gringo

Tough position. Few things to ponder; how stable is your corporate position? Meaning, with the worlds economy seemingly (again) on the brink of implosion, corporate flight departments are usually the first to get axed.

Then again, so are new hires (aka "Furlough Fodder") at ALL the airlines, not just UPS.

Hopefully, as a 30's age group guy you were able to stash lots of cash from your high paying job to see you through either scenario.

Long term? UPS is probably the better bet. Short term? It's probably going to be a turbulent ride no matter what you choose.

CargoDriver

M40,

check your PM

nightrider

I was in hired in 2001, I so far have enjoyed 9/11, 2 recessions, changing of the retirement age and parking of the 3 man fleets, the airline had 241 airframes when I arrived and around 219 now, I will say that in the next 10 yrs we have 1018 retirements scheduled add another 300 or so for medical and early retirements, so I would guess you will probably upgrade to Capt in 6 to 8 yrs, 10 yrs at the latest, the pay is good, retirement for now is good and insurance is good, however the next 8 to 10 yrs are going to be rough, being up all night and flying base trip lines with 6 reports a month are tough, you will never feel rested or normal like you do now, the company is reasonably stable but you can't believe a word that they say, not that they tell us anything anyway, there are trade offs for everything but be prepared for literally 5 to 7 yrs of hell if you decide to come here and if you take the first available Capt upgrade, it will be another 8 to 10 yrs of hell, after years of getting beat up and having no cicadium rhythms left in your body the money won't matter, everything being equal if I were in your shoes I would consider delta, American or United. Not being negative just the honest truth the only thing that we have going for us is a defined benefit plan, overall most of us are miserable and a lot of it has to do with the night time operation which is unavoidable, good luck just trying to be honest.

flyingagain

Nightrider's comments are very similar to what I hear from some friends who went to UPS.

I'm not looking for a job at a major, but if I was the legacy carriers seem like a better deal all things considered.

Section Eight

So I am pretty negative about this place, and I get that, so this is worth exactly what you paid for it.

SOunds like you have your mind made up, and that's cool. You're a place many others want to be and soon you may have a decision to make. Let me ask you this?

You current job, how would you feel if your employer moved you from your base now to another base (again this is probably hypothetical), only to move you to another 6 months from now? And that goes on for the next 9 years?

Also, you mentioned nice hotels and good meal, rental cars, etc.

Imagine your current employer putting you in the nastiest, cheapest hole there is, with mold, bed bugs, street "ladies", maids cleaning while your trying to sleep, etc. Only to find out that you're at this "gem"of a hotel because the Fairmont (example) across the street is $1 more, A whole dollar more. Add to that the free breakfast has been negotiated OUT of the deal because one of your "bosses" (who has no experience doing what you've been doing for the last 20 years) had to look good to the company for some reason. "Look, I saved a dollar per stay"(and I am serious about the ONE dollar part).

Ok, so now you've been kept up all day listening to the maids try to clean the rooms above and below you, and you have to muster to fly all night like some sort of Zombie, no problem your 30 ish now? See how you look in 15-20 years.

Rental Car? Forget about it, you may save the company hundreds of dollars, but they will make you expense your car and you may see that money in 60 ish days, not to mention you got the insurance like you were supposed to, but the car company your employer wanted didn't have cars, so the extra insurance is something YOU just paid for, THINKING you were getting remibursed, but you're not.

Do they pay well? Absolutely, but the union FIGHTS, and I mean fights for every single thing we have.

I'll expect the usual " if it's so easy, go elsewhere", and I have considered it, but I may be past V1 here.

I'll express the same sentiment another 07 hire has, if I were younger I would trade with you. Money is not everything in life, and this place WILL take its toll on you.

It's easy for guys like 7576 (no offense) to say do your job and go home. But when you are in a constant state of training, constant displacements, furlough, etc for NINE YEARS it gets really, really F-ing old. The stress is a killer and I can tell you there is no signs of growth, in fact there has not been one positive thing happen here since I got hired. Seniority is everything, everywhere. When you have hundreds (if not thousands) of retirements all over the industry I'd look hard at brown.

Now, you are in a unique situation, and I get that. It's a hard call, but if your happy, your family is happy, and you are ENJOYING your job and can wait until someone with growth hires you, then I'd consider it. You make a fair wage and sounds like other than being gone about the same time you'd be gone here.

Carry on.......

I really need to get back to my adult coloring.

busdriver12

I think a problem for you is that you have the sentimental factor of your father having flown for UPS. That feeling may fade quickly, and I suggest you consider your options without that factor in the mix.

For example, I didn't read if you were commuting now, and if you were planning on moving to a UPS base. Or how stable your corporate job actually is, as flight departments are one of the first things cut when a company starts cutting costs.

I don't fly for UPS, but just on the information you have given, I think I might do this.....take the training date when it comes, go to work for UPS. But keep your applications in for the majors that you think might work out better (and FedEx). See what happens with UPS, the new contract, how the job is working out for you, do you enjoy it as much as you thought you might, and if someone else calls, then you can make another choice at that point.

DangaZone

There are a number of 2014/2015 hires who came from part 91 operations, including large-cabin and/or Fortune 100 departments, some of whom were in their 30s.

One guy went back to his corporate job prior to completion of IOE because of a number of reasons (awful commute, difficulty adjusting to schedule, and his employer gave HUGE raises)...but I'd say the rest are pretty happy with the change.

As a corporate pilot, you know flexibility is a big part of the job...right? As such, if you were hired and were willing to move to domicile (91 guys move all the time for jobs) and bid reserve, you can enjoy QOL better than one might expect a junior pilot to have and MUCH better than that of a junior commuter.

This place has some very real flaws which require a person to balance their personal situation with the pros/cons of the job...but it isn't the prison colony some make it out to be. Good luck with your decision.

BPWI

Long time lurker, first time poster in this section.....

I am in a similar position, however I would need an act of God to pull the trigger. I have a immense amount of respect for all the cargo guys. Certainly to get to the point where UPS/FED are willing to offer you employment. That being said, unless you plan to live in base and have a very understanding wife.....I'd be wary.
Please keep us advised of what you decide and best of luck either way!