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Old 05-03-2018, 09:46 AM   #1
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Joined APC: Jan 2009
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Default Legacy to Corporate, post age 65 retirement

Greetings all-knowing gurus,

I'm retiring from a legacy next March and have been considering a corporate job that would last about 5 years or so.

I'm curious is Bizjetjobs.com is a good source, or would you look elsewhere.

Also, to be honest, I have no bizjet experience, which is why I'm looking for help from the experienced pros here. I do have type ratings in B737, 757, 767 and 777, as well as A320.

Any advice or recommendations on where to search or prep, are greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Tom
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Old 05-03-2018, 12:42 PM   #2
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Bizjetjobs might work, as would careers websites at Jet Aviation or EJM, but without serious networking and contacts, probably bleak even in today’s market. It’s a different beast than airline flying and enough money is being offered that operators want a record in business aviation.

I’m coming from being a chief pilot who’s seen the resume quality decline precipitously. Flying the jet is everything at 121; it’s seriously only 25% of corporate. No, I’m not talking about cleaning the plane (we don’t), but lots of operators today fly international where, it’s all on the pilot sto “make it happen”. It’s about anticipating all the things agents, TSA, dispatchers, airline management take care of and you don’t see. Passenger forgets his passport in India, it’s on you and, perhaps, a handler to get her thru Immigration. Handler in Accra says, “cash only fuel”; it’s on you to change his mind, even when he parks the fuel truck in front of the wing. Flying Petropalovsk to Tahiti, no dispatcher will confirm that the fuel boarded will ensure divert capability to Christmas Island. Boss wants to operate at East Hampton which is just doable in a Global, if it’s dry. You have to persuade him it’s not a good idea. Yes, those have happened to me.

GF
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Old 05-03-2018, 03:27 PM   #3
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I recently retired from United. I've interviewed for a few corporate positions that I received the "Thanks, but no thanks". I had corporate and 135 experience from 35 years ago. I took a position in the charter market. Not the most ideal because you will work twice as hard as you are use to at 121. Getting your foot in the door and proving you aren't, as some in the corporate world believe (it may be true of some but not all) lazy entitled airline pilot.

I enjoy the current flying, and hope to find a better position while doing the best job I can at my present employer. You may also subscribe to "climbto350.com". They have many positions advertised. If you are on Facebook, try the group "Corporate Aviation Job Listings".

Also join ProPilotWorld.

Last edited by phlying4fun; 05-03-2018 at 03:30 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 05-03-2018, 04:09 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galaxy flyer View Post
Bizjetjobs might work, as would careers websites at Jet Aviation or EJM, but without serious networking and contacts, probably bleak even in today’s market. It’s a different beast than airline flying and enough money is being offered that operators want a record in business aviation.

I’m coming from being a chief pilot who’s seen the resume quality decline precipitously. Flying the jet is everything at 121; it’s seriously only 25% of corporate. No, I’m not talking about cleaning the plane (we don’t), but lots of operators today fly international where, it’s all on the pilot sto “make it happen”. It’s about anticipating all the things agents, TSA, dispatchers, airline management take care of and you don’t see. Passenger forgets his passport in India, it’s on you and, perhaps, a handler to get her thru Immigration. Handler in Accra says, “cash only fuel”; it’s on you to change his mind, even when he parks the fuel truck in front of the wing. Flying Petropalovsk to Tahiti, no dispatcher will confirm that the fuel boarded will ensure divert capability to Christmas Island. Boss wants to operate at East Hampton which is just doable in a Global, if it’s dry. You have to persuade him it’s not a good idea. Yes, those have happened to me.

GF
Thanks GF for the input. Is there a particular networking site you can point me toward, or should I just head out to my local FBOs (I'm in the IAD/DCA area) and start introducing myself?

Interesting challenges that you relate. I'm going to guess that for the Passport and fueler issue, that discrete application of Presidential influence may work (particularly President Grant) with help from Benjamin Franklin.

Thanks again.

T
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Old 05-03-2018, 04:11 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phlying4fun View Post
I recently retired from United. I've interviewed for a few corporate positions that I received the "Thanks, but no thanks". I had corporate and 135 experience from 35 years ago. I took a position in the charter market. Not the most ideal because you will work twice as hard as you are use to at 121. Getting your foot in the door and proving you aren't, as some in the corporate world believe (it may be true of some but not all) lazy entitled airline pilot.

I enjoy the current flying, and hope to find a better position while doing the best job I can at my present employer. You may also subscribe to "climbto350.com". They have many positions advertised. If you are on Facebook, try the group "Corporate Aviation Job Listings".

Also join ProPilotWorld.
Thanks Phlying, much appreciated!

T
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Old 05-03-2018, 06:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsquared030 View Post
Thanks GF for the input. Is there a particular networking site you can point me toward, or should I just head out to my local FBOs (I'm in the IAD/DCA area) and start introducing myself?

Interesting challenges that you relate. I'm going to guess that for the Passport and fueler issue, that discrete application of Presidential influence may work (particularly President Grant) with help from Benjamin Franklin.

Thanks again.

T
ProPilotWorld (paywall) might be helpful. I’d guess most 135 operators wouldn’t be willing type rate, you might find one that will. It’s a huge expense for something like a Gulfstream or Global; less for less well-paying types. It’s the type rating that might be your biggest hurdle—$80,000 + for those types. Check the Jet Aviation or Rxecutive Jet Management sites. Those are usually great jobs, but usually want experience in type.

No, offering money up front is as likely to cause a problem than fix one. In the passport case, my passengers were well connected and quickly solved the problem. I just stood my ground in Accra and out-waited them. It’s a different side of aviation. I went to two countries (Gabon and Montenegro) where the Immigration authorities took one look at who we were with and just said, “have a good evening, don’t stop by again”.

GF
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Old 05-04-2018, 04:45 AM   #7
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Just remember, if you go to corporate, the airline favorite line of "its not my job" never applies. There are lots of unsavory things you'll need to do, probably because no one else will do it, or no one else will do a good enough job. If you go 135, there won't be a locked door between you and your pax, so if you fly someone that is a royal PITA, you have to deal with them directly. There is no flight attendant or gate agent to pass them off to.

Personally I can't imagine doing retail 135 post 65, especially after retiring from a major, but to each their own....
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Old 05-04-2018, 06:42 AM   #8
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There are lots of jobs out there right now and retired airline pilots are definitely getting picked up. I'm in Norfolk and about half of our local pilots (most hired in the last year or two) are recently retired legacy.

Your best bet up in DC will be Manassas (KHEF). There are a few operators there that have been posting jobs pretty consistently. Chantilly Air comes to mind.

Also, as others have said, flying is very little of the job on the 91/135 side. You have heavy experience that is probably mostly international. That's great, but it does not qualify you to be a Gulfstream or Global Captain. Especially since you've never flown on the business jet side. There is a lot of coordination required for International trips that you have never been a part of. Aim for a position as large cabin SIC or small/mid PIC.
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Old 05-04-2018, 07:12 AM   #9
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There’s also a huge difference between retail 91K or 135 and private 91. Part 91 you probably have a less restrictive budget, a flight attendant in large cabin planes and an ongoing relationship with the boss. His schedule is your schedule and some buy the plane to do business and go home. I have a friend who brags he only buys drinks on the expense account while on the boss’s (and his) vacation. Takes or flies his wife out to wherever the annual vacation is.

Part 135 is different everyday, expenses are watched, planes more beat, everyday is a “fly day”. Customers look at you as a cabbie.

GF
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Old 05-04-2018, 10:12 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galaxy flyer View Post

Part 135 is different everyday, expenses are watched, planes more beat, everyday is a “fly day”. Customers look at you as a cabbie.

GF
Excellent. You just described a part 121job.
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