Scooter74

I have a client looking at buying one of these with the the FIKI/Ver 1.7 upgrade.

I was looking to get feed back from anyone with first hand knowledge of the plane, any issues it has after getting the upgrade, and possible "hang ups" he should look for in the plane before buying it.

This will be a personal plane, owner flown on personal trips/vacations.

Thanks for any input!

S

Grumble

Personally, I'd stay away from the thing. Been a troubled company from the start, and it's an unknown quantity and unproven over the long term. It rode a short wave of success from the initial wow factor and the wheels came off shortly after. Cool plane, could be a potential money pit.

For the cash I'd buy a TBM.

KiloAlpha

TBM'S have a poor useful load to fuel (range)

BoilerUP

TBM850s have in the ballpark of 800lbs full-fuel useful load; C2s aren't much worse but yeah, As and Bs are pretty low (200-300lb).

The folks that restarted Eclipse have skin in the game (they're Eclipse owners themselves) and have dedicated a lot of their own money to get the airframe to make good on its original promise. Its essentially a jet-powered Baron, but has stellar operating economics for an owner-operator compared to many other airframes.

That said, for what a FIKI Eclipse sells for these days you could get a tried & true CitationJet, a mature airframe with excellent nationwide support. Sure DOCs are higher, but you've got anti-skid, good external baggage, a fully functional autopilot, and no operating restrictions due to insufficient engine bleed air at altitude.

elcidflyer04

If the guy is stuck on a vlj maybe he should check out the Phenom 100. I have never flown one but have talked to some 100 pilots. It seems like a fun plane to fly with performance to boot. It cost a lot more than the ea500.

Learflyer

we have two eclipse sims at my training center. I can't believe that thing has only two circuit breakers!

Scooter74

Thank you, I always appreciate the input.

He has considered TBM's but they are easily another 500K and that is for the 700.

He has found a pretty good price for a low time (below 100 hrs) Eclipse that after paying the upgrade price would keep him in his range (1.2 max initial cost). He is drawn to the Eclipse because of the low operating costs (he can afford more expensive aircraft but doesn't want to pay the operating costs associated with those planes...ie KA 90/200 and C500 series)

I have no dog in the game so if anyone can give me any input on the plus and minus of the Eclipse that would be great.

thanks again!

BoilerUP

Plus on the Eclipse is its low acquisition & operating cost.

Minus is its still very much an unproven airframe, lacking in widespread support, with parts availability issues, an incomplete autoflight system, and runway length numbers that do not meet Part 23 Commuter Category/Part 25 climb requirements.

Ewfflyer

Guess this is why I love the internet, full of information, and even fuller of misinformation.

TBM700A/B both have lower useful loads with full fuel(which is 281gal) you would get about 264lbs useful(Actual number from a 700B we have in inventory). Sacrifice 80gal, gain 536lbs, and still go 700nm at around 275ktas, 50-55gph.

The 700C2 and 850's all have around 800+lbs with full fuel, so by far easier to load and go the long haul if desired. The 850's with the G1000 add an additional 10gal of useful also.

Now, my opinions on the EA500 are that initially, they just were way too far ahead of themselves before they even had some planes produced. I think the physical airframe itself is fantastic, but the systems leave something to be desired. I have noticed a lot more around the midwest since spring this year.

I was supposed to fly one at my old job(but the boss wisely bailed on them), but our check-airman started on his type rating and did say they flew very well, just you couldn't do anything with them due to all the "INOP" paperweights. I do believe the current owners will slowly improve on what they have, but if something breaks, no one really knows how they are going to be able to help out or how soon.

Depending on the range of trips, if you are looking at 700nm or less, a TBM700A/B(they should be in the $1.1-1.5mil range) or a used Piper Meridian wouldn't be a bad choice either in that price range. No type rating, lesser insurance costs, proven histories etc.. But, it's not a jet, so that always sways some folks.

skykingtwo

"Guess this is why I love the internet, full of information, and even fuller of misinformation."

Ditto that sentiment. Personally I refrain from offering my opinion if I haven't flown the machine, but that is just me... I am a Pilot Examiner in the Eclipse 500 with over 1000 hours in type; my opinion is that for the money, it is the best value going today. Hey, if you have $3MM there are other, better equipped options out there - THAT IS WHY THEY CALL THIS A VERY LIGHT JET! It is light in weight and light on the pocket book. 65 GPH / 440 PPH total burn at FL410. Pretty damned efficient!

Yes, the original Eclipse went bankrupt, and lots of investors/vendors got screwed in that process, but the new Eclipse Aerospace is up and running under different management, parts are readily available from numerous sources, and most of the start-up problems of the first few years are behind the airplane now. Great technology, P&W power is fantastic, FIKI 1.7 solves nearly every problem in the early development of the airplane and from my seat, no better value out there for missions requiring less than 1000 miles and 4 seats. If you want to see for yourself - I have an airplane you can fly in California! gw