Those pro-pension restoration types are vocal, but they are in the minority by a large margin. I can count on one hand the number of CA’s that I’ve flown with who still think a pension is a good thing....even when I ask how the last one is working out for them.

I would love to see one of them make a rational argument on why someone with 20-30 years left in their career should give up 16%(or more) in 401K contributions for the promise from the company and the union to take care of their retirement later.

They reality for them is that even if a pension lasted for a few years into their retirement before it went bust they would be better off dollar wise then a larger DC percentage. They just can’t use that argument or rationale to change a young persons mind about restarting a pension scheme because their true motivations will be revealed.

I wonder how many of them, if they could have a do over would still take a pension with the known risks, vs a DC with the known risks?

I take my money upfront and assume the much smaller risk.

 

It would be a spectacular blunder if they attempted this as rumored (kill the DC to get a DB, in ANY form whatsoever).

Absolute non starter, no deal, No vote by an easy majority, no matter what else was in it. C19 deal killer, big time, and the resulting delays (likely something the company wants, especially if it can be blamed squarely on us) will cost us, all for no gain at the end of that road because it still won't ever happen. If true, this is a ridiculous strategy. But DB's are emotional and the imagined security and predictability is absolutely intoxicating.

As the saying goes: You cannot reason people out of something they were not reasoned into.

As dumb an idea as this is, I could actually see it being floated.

 

Every re I've spoken to has said that they are talking about in addition to DC...not getting rid of it. Although I'd rather just have an increased DC


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A DB is crazy talk even as an addition to DC because NEGOTIATING CAPITAL. Any DB we ask for is going to cause a huge downside somewhere else i.e. pay, dc, healthcare, qol or something else. The company would have to plan to actually pay out the DB and every pilot would have to plan to not get it.

 

This. Even if I had it, I couldn't count on it. Kiddos might be thrilled to have a (arguably) larger inheritance, but I'm not interested in that gamble.

 

THIS!
Filler

 

Smartest post on the internet today.

 

I'm for increasing the DC up to the point where the company almost maxes it out for me and I'd love to see the HSA company contributions increased as well.

The problem is that the IRS determines the maximum we can put into these two tax advantaged account types. Is there any way to lobby to get these limits increased? Or are there other POST-TAX (but tax advantaged) vehicles that are not limited by 415(c) that can be our money, in our name?

I'm already doing as well as I can with the HSA, 401(k) and 401(k)ROTH accounts, protecting my earnings from taxes either now or later. I'm just thinking of options for MY money.

 

1) Add a back door Roth IRA to the mix.

2) You can also consider a mega back door Roth IRA. Google and Bing are your friends on that one.

3) Owning income property is the best tax advantaged vehicle outside of the accounts you mentioned. There are no 415C limits, returns are indexed for inflation, the entire asset class is tax advantaged and investments can be leveraged for greater return. It doesn't have to involve fixing toilets and painting on your days off. jasonhartman.com is a good starting place for a novice investor in single family income property. There are plenty of commercial options available in NNN leases, multifamily, RV parks, self storage and trailer parks. DYODD, etc...

 

First of all...I didn't say anything about DB restoration. Even though I'll be retiring soon, I'm not interested in that either. Second, I did say improved healthcare was a worthwhile goal. I also acknowledged that the pilots with Tricare are not a majority. The main point of my post was that not every pilot needs it as you said in the post I quoted. So...just like you said it doesn't benefit YOU to expend negotiating capital on a DB, it doesn't benefit the Tricare group (yes, a minority) to expend negotiating capital on medical benefits. As I said in my first post...one man's trash is another man's treasure. That's why the majority will eventually iron out the details. It's been that way for a long, long time and I'm OK with that too. You have a nice day now.