Retirement Shortfall Letter
07-10-2018, 04:05 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,921
Originally Posted by gzsg
I couldn’t disagree more.
We will make major gains in retirement in C2019.
Soon we will retire close to 1000 pilots a year generating 6000+ training events annually.
We have the leverage.
We will make major gains in retirement in C2019.
Soon we will retire close to 1000 pilots a year generating 6000+ training events annually.
We have the leverage.
Here’s a prediction. We draw out this contract for 5 years while you guys all retire, then settle for a signing bonus so you don’t get anything.
Are you really that naive to think that negotiationg for a pension or pension-like retirement will not divide the group further? I could see negotiating some retireee health benefits, but free money isn’t going to happen. It’s just wasting everyone’s time.
07-10-2018, 04:08 PM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 4,458
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
This letter is dividing to the group. It shows that the union is trying to do exactly what happened in 1996. Set up the guys on the way out. The guys who got an extra 5 years at the top at my expense (my extra 5 years were at the bottom.)
07-10-2018, 04:09 PM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
Same guy who thought we would have a new contract in a day if we voted one down. 17 months later we had one.
Here’s a prediction. We draw out this contract for 5 years while you guys all retire, then settle for a signing bonus so you don’t get anything.
Are you really that naive to think that negotiationg for a pension or pension-like retirement will not divide the group further? I could see negotiating some retireee health benefits, but free money isn’t going to happen. It’s just wasting everyone’s time.
Here’s a prediction. We draw out this contract for 5 years while you guys all retire, then settle for a signing bonus so you don’t get anything.
Are you really that naive to think that negotiationg for a pension or pension-like retirement will not divide the group further? I could see negotiating some retireee health benefits, but free money isn’t going to happen. It’s just wasting everyone’s time.
I'm personally amenable to working towards something to help those who lost so much in retirement, but only if it includes everyone who lost regardless of present status. A pension or similar is a non starter though. That ship has sailed, if it was taken once it can be taken again.
07-10-2018, 04:10 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,921
Originally Posted by WhiskeyDelta
You sure? The contract isn’t even amendable until Dec 31, 2019. Why would we get arbitration that early?
This is an extremely divisive issue. We have already lost since the MEC is catering to the vocal minority.
07-10-2018, 04:13 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,108
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
Same guy who thought we would have a new contract in a day if we voted one down. 17 months later we had one.
Here’s a prediction. We draw out this contract for 5 years while you guys all retire, then settle for a signing bonus so you don’t get anything.
Are you really that naive to think that negotiationg for a pension or pension-like retirement will not divide the group further? I could see negotiating some retireee health benefits, but free money isn’t going to happen. It’s just wasting everyone’s time.
Here’s a prediction. We draw out this contract for 5 years while you guys all retire, then settle for a signing bonus so you don’t get anything.
Are you really that naive to think that negotiationg for a pension or pension-like retirement will not divide the group further? I could see negotiating some retireee health benefits, but free money isn’t going to happen. It’s just wasting everyone’s time.
Here is the bottom line for every Delta pilot.
The Billion are there. Providing a retirement befitting a professional air line pilot is easily achievable.
Hockey is see this as a moral imparitive. You see at as shortfall pilots taking dollars from you.
Your attitude makes me disappointed. I hope you are in the vast minority.
How did Delta become so profitable?
On the backs of these shortfall pilots and their families.
Is the pain over for these families? No!
Pilots with a shortfall will have to work extra days each month until age 65 to partially repair their shortfall.
Their families will continue to suffer. All while our executives light billions on fire with buybacks to enrich themselves.
07-10-2018, 04:22 PM
#16
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Posts: 39
Just trying to learn here: How many Delta shares did effected pilots receive? I believe it may have been a range based on time of service? Along those lines, there is a monthly payout upon retirement, no? How was that calculated? Lastly, what year did the 401K DB start? And what has its progression from 12% been? Thanks!
07-10-2018, 04:23 PM
#17
Quality of Lifer
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Position: M88A
Posts: 672
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
This letter is dividing to the group. It shows that the union is trying to do exactly what happened in 1996. Set up the guys on the way out. The guys who got an extra 5 years at the top at my expense (my extra 5 years were at the bottom.)
Some of my hostility comes from the merger. I was part of 150 pilots who received less retirement than everyone else for a few years because the NWA MEC was fighting to try and get more for themselves which ended up in us getting less and the 150 of us getting forgotten about.
Life isn’t fair and now these pilots are fighting for something that only they will benefit from. I don’t buy the unity part.
Some of my hostility comes from the merger. I was part of 150 pilots who received less retirement than everyone else for a few years because the NWA MEC was fighting to try and get more for themselves which ended up in us getting less and the 150 of us getting forgotten about.
Life isn’t fair and now these pilots are fighting for something that only they will benefit from. I don’t buy the unity part.
07-10-2018, 04:27 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: Taxi Driver
Posts: 411
Originally Posted by gzsg
You seem very selfish to me. Caring only for yourself. I gain nothing from this. I have no retirement shortfall.
Here is the bottom line for every Delta pilot.
The Billion are there. Providing a retirement befitting a professional air line pilot is easily achievable.
Hockey is see this as a moral imparitive. You see at as shortfall pilots taking dollars from you.
Your attitude makes me disappointed. I hope you are in the vast minority.
How did Delta become so profitable?
On the backs of these shortfall pilots and their families.
Is the pain over for these families? No!
Pilots with a shortfall will have to work extra days each month until age 65 to partially repair their shortfall.
Their families will continue to suffer. All while our executives light billions on fire with buybacks to enrich themselves.
Here is the bottom line for every Delta pilot.
The Billion are there. Providing a retirement befitting a professional air line pilot is easily achievable.
Hockey is see this as a moral imparitive. You see at as shortfall pilots taking dollars from you.
Your attitude makes me disappointed. I hope you are in the vast minority.
How did Delta become so profitable?
On the backs of these shortfall pilots and their families.
Is the pain over for these families? No!
Pilots with a shortfall will have to work extra days each month until age 65 to partially repair their shortfall.
Their families will continue to suffer. All while our executives light billions on fire with buybacks to enrich themselves.
I have really had enough of the selfish talk from a bunch of guys who have gotten to have their careers extended by five more years, many of whom flew green slips while we had thousands out on furlough. As far as being easily achievable, how exactly? Posting on FB or APC? Sending confrontational letters to the company leadership with artificial drop dead dates?
We all want two things; us to be making as much as we can and for the company to be financially strong. The reality is that we have to take some responsibility now for our own retirement. It absolutely sucks that our pensions are either gone or frozen, but that's the way life goes sometimes. I just don't see dividing us into deadzoners vs. new guys and throwing around tough talk with nothing to back it up as a real way of achieving anything other than a drawn out contract with no real gains. Please prove me wrong.
07-10-2018, 04:29 PM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: DAL FO
Posts: 2,142
Originally Posted by gzsg
You seem very selfish to me. Caring only for yourself. I gain nothing from this. I have no retirement shortfall.
Here is the bottom line for every Delta pilot.
The Billion are there. Providing a retirement befitting a professional air line pilot is easily achievable.
Hockey is see this as a moral imparitive. You see at as shortfall pilots taking dollars from you.
Your attitude makes me disappointed. I hope you are in the vast minority.
How did Delta become so profitable?
On the backs of these shortfall pilots and their families.
Is the pain over for these families? No!
Pilots with a shortfall will have to work extra days each month until age 65 to partially repair their shortfall.
Their families will continue to suffer. All while our executives light billions on fire with buybacks to enrich themselves.
Here is the bottom line for every Delta pilot.
The Billion are there. Providing a retirement befitting a professional air line pilot is easily achievable.
Hockey is see this as a moral imparitive. You see at as shortfall pilots taking dollars from you.
Your attitude makes me disappointed. I hope you are in the vast minority.
How did Delta become so profitable?
On the backs of these shortfall pilots and their families.
Is the pain over for these families? No!
Pilots with a shortfall will have to work extra days each month until age 65 to partially repair their shortfall.
Their families will continue to suffer. All while our executives light billions on fire with buybacks to enrich themselves.
You, Jerry, are exactly in the demographic that you keep insisting should benefit from this land grab.
Keep repeating it though, I really think you’re getting somewhere :-)
Maybe the MEC should listen to their polling data that shows them the vast majority of the pilot group are in favor of improving pay/QOL for ALL pilots...
...and not funding a Hail Mary for your demographic as you head for the exits
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