LEC Elections
 

There are critical LEC elections underway right now.

C44, C20, and C81 elections are now in the general election phase.

FREE STARBUCKS IF YOU VOTE IN THE C44 LEC REP ELECTIONS
Fellow C44 pilots:
We are so close to improving our ability to have our voices heard at the MEC and the negotiating table. The results of the nomination vote clearly show that C44 is hungry for a transformation of our leadership style from one of personal ambition to one of true pilot advocacy.
We now have the opportunity to elect proven pilot advocates, some of whom have been targeted by members of the current MEC to even be fired. This is the time to pay attention.
The nomination phase of our election only resulted in 13% of the total eligible members participating in the voting process.
This level of participation will NOT give your newly elected reps the mandate they need to force your agenda upon the negotiating process with the company. We need an army behind us to accomplish your goals. You have GOT to vote; one way or the other, but VOTE.
Your collective participation will profoundly affect your career, trust me on this.
What is up with the title of this letter? It was to get your attention. If you walk up to me in the terminal and call me out on it, it’s my treat.
Fraternally,
Ben Stout
ALPA# 1269232
[email protected]

Must be.

"Pilot Advocate" = Talk big, bash management every chance you get to feel good and look cool but never get anything accomplished while collecting copious amounts of FPL barely flying the line, if at all.

FYI, in the 35 RJs Hearing Management Council read a snippet from "The Wave", the title of the LEC Communication Updates from the "pilot advocates" of Council 16(LAX), to the arbitrator, using it as evidence against DALPA. Council 16 desires to have their style of "pilot advocacy" spread thru out the Horseshoe.

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Awesome. When are you going to be in the terminal in ATL? I'd love to take you up on that offer!

this is an important point to share. As an ex volunteer and union fan nothing bugs me more than jag idiots who are elected because they give the best rah-rah speeches. The union needs quiet and intelligent planners and executers who work on the inside to get substantive goals accomplished.
A lot of loud idiots get in reps seats because its a popularity contest and that stuff sells. Sometimes they find out they can't process whats going on because they are too stupid, so the make up for it with cliche crap. Its embarrassing. It happens more on the rep side than other merit based volunteers, but it can happen on both.

Find reps who will talk in person or on the phone very honestly and keep the txts and emails very professional. Reps SCREW over their pilots by writing things like "hold management accountable" and "speak with actions" and other dumb ****. Pilots arent in charge, the NMB is. If the NMB is happy they let us and managers work on our own. The NMB is in our talks now, so it behooves everyone to remind their reps to act like professional adults. If your rep team are idiots and anything other than professional tell them they're screwing this up for us, and straighten up.

They can read anything they want as evidence. The comm you are referring to was vetted by ALPA legal and DALPA SCOPE prior to being published...

You can tell that the 4th floor is getting nervous when their resident apologist comes on here to rally against pro-pilot alpa advocates such as the OP.

Nobody is getting nervous. We've seen this story before in recent years under the BB and RS led MECs. Vote in radicals and Management will say see you at arbitration/NMB and slam the door. Then they will have their counsel will run laps around DALPA at the meeting. Loud with a lack of intelligence, rationale or acceptance of facts are not good combos for MEC or LEC Reps. All this is hypothetical though as I doubt the pilot group is willing to go that dark direction again.

You may continue on with the "pilot advocate" rah rah rah


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Sometimes the answer is no. Not everything is negotiable.

Sometimes... Absolutely agree.

With these "Pilot Advocates" it's No everytime. There is no Yes in their DNA. It's just the way they're wired. They would say No if the company offered them a magic carpet ride to a cave full of Gold. Take a look at Council 16 Wave updates on Aerodocs if you want a good laugh.

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So you’re saying the company is Jafar?:D

Is Guum the bird?

ALPA advocate?

You mean the same Ben Stout that’s been actively trying to overthrow ALPA for years via DPA?

But free Starbucks!

Yes vote, but make sure you know what you’re voting for

He still hasn't let us know when he'll be in the terminal for free Starbucks

Free beer tomorrow.

You got one "Pilot Advocate" opening up a campaign letter offering Free Starbucks. You got another one running solely on suing the company/govt over COVID testing and other medical "Freedom" initiatives. You can't make this stuff up

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interesting you know so much just being a line pilot. But, that’s not your end game now is it so carry on. I’m sure your making at least some sort of impression.

First time that I've ever seen an ALPA Rep try to stop a safety initiative.

you mean the same council that has the highest approval rating from their constituents than any other council? That one?

So, in political questionnaires( which is what you are alluding to) ....have you even known a group to be against those that "promise" them more, bigger, and better shiznit at "no" cost to them.....you know, the rich should pay their fair share. In this case, the rich would be Delta, pitted against the poor downtrodden line pilot. ......polls can be so misleading....the underlying question is, "What is the bias of the voter"?. in this case, the will support those that promise them more even if it unsustainable or impactable.. just like politics. Sometimes polls are appropriate....sometimes...not so much...they are more insights into pipe dreams. YMMV

Talking big even though it yields little to no results does gain popularity in some Councils. We'll see how long that lasts. I've spoken to multiple neutral folks that worked in the MEC Admin. Apparently Council 16 Reps are hard to work with and don't acknowledge facts unless it goes along with their agenda. Lots of talk of them taking the fullest advantage of FPL as well.

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Always more popular to tell people what they want to hear as opposed what they need to hear.

The holding the line is what led to the gains we got in LOA 20-04, MOU 21-01. BTW, the 16 Chairman voted yes on 2/4 of the LOAs last year and the 16 Vice voted yes on 3/4. So tell me again that they are 'no' to everything? I can also tell you that those statements from your sources are incorrect.

their job is to represent the wishes of their constituents. Considering they were re-elected and polling higher in satisfaction than any other council, they are doing what they were elected to do.

where are the approval ratings published?

LEC Elections
 

It's up to each council to release them from the polling data. We've asked to have them all released and the answer is always "it's up to each individual council"


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The problem with DALPA as I see it is not with any particular group of Reps - its the structure. We have many well meaning folks that participate and then become totally enthralled with the FP Loss and the lifestyle, staying in union positions for years if not decades. If I were King for a day I would require all DALPA personnel to return back to the line for as long as they were serving in between DALPA gigs. Serve three years as a Rep - go to the line for the next three years. Serve 18 months in an Admin position - back to the line for 18 months minimum.

Some of these guys simply reek of desperation to avoid line flying and others lose touch with some of the day to day challenges of the Line Pilot. I always said that I wanted the DALPA gig to be good to draw the best folks, but perhaps its so good we have guys who start off with the best intentions and end up sticking in the job for self serving reasons.

Scoop - just my 2 cents

I'd support that. We had some real FPL gems at my old company and theyre here too. The problem is, some of the well meaning types who really excel need a few years at the job to become amazing at it. The thing that always fixed the FPL sniffers was more pilot involvement, more volunteers, more eyes watching these little dickheads milk the union. Word gets around and guys get tossed.

No one likes a mooching freeloader.

I shared your concerns and talked to my rep back in the day when there was more movement to change things administratively (the kind of stuff that happens between contracts). I got really bored one winter and tried to track things down because people would complain in the crew lounge/bus and nothing seemed to ever get done. I actually spoke with BB at an event and he was completely tuned into this issue and was working on fixing it (he struck me as an administrative kind of wonk). I think they put together some kind of team to look at things, and according to the minutes, and it seemed like some things were changed (about the time that MEMRAT for LOAs came about). That was all apparently around 2017 when things were getting re-wired to make things more accountable.

As it was explained to me, there's a pretty broad range of ALPA involvement levels. The vast majority of the committee guys & gals are part time. No flight pay loss, except for a couple days each year for a meeting, and they just do things on their own time. There are full time committee chairs and members, along with the officers (of which there are 4), but the actual full time number is still pretty low. Some committee chairs are only part time, and go into the office on an as-needed basis.

Reps, OTOH, are not full time, and, in theory fly full lines, but between MEC sponsored activities which pay (office duty, CPO meetings, lounge duty) there is apparently considerable flexibility in dropping trips. My (former) rep in MSP told me that he would get 4-6 emails a day, and maybe 6 phone calls a week. Some were easy answers, but maybe 4-6 a month were pretty serious "need help now" kind of events. He went on to say he did something ALPA related to the tune of at least an hour on every overnight. That would get old pretty quick, IMHO.

None of this is secret. The FPL reports are right on the treasurer's page on the MEC website along with a guide that explains how it works. Is there more there? I don't know. I just got a refund check a little while ago, so they seem to run things fairly tight. Some people complain of folks sticking around in these positions, but then some complain about the constant turnover, so I'm not really sure what the balance is.

seems like a Hitchens’ razor kinda moment

Some councils don't want to release the results, some do. I personally think all polling results should be released.

We just ran out own survey in my council that closes next week and we will be releasing the results to our council.


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Waste of time IMO. The job is simple. Represent the will of your Council. If you don't, you get recalled like like the FO Reps that voted for BB instead of JM for MEC Chair.

It's not rocket science to figure out what direction the pilot group wants to go. I think forums like APC and WidgetFB do a great job representing the will of the Pilot Group in general.

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Reserve is just a choice. I remember those words come every election cycle.

C16 is the worst, and the worst of the worst is the FO rep. The guy has spent his whole DAL career figuring out ways to get paid and not fly, and has settled on ALPA as his latest way to do that.

The only pilot he’s an advocate for is himself.

Agree 1000% percent. They are doing a disservice to our pilot group and our profession

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Let me guess you guys are Council 44 and/or 66 right?

I think you been wearing your masks to tight.

Yeah and if you’re a rep then you have access to NDA info that us line dogs don’t. Reps have a bigger and more in-depth picture. I expect reps to vote and act based on that, not on social media popularity contests.

It should be based on the will of the constituents. That's what they are doing.


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No, it should be a moderate mix of both.

Totally asinine!

lol, 44. Well known wanna be.