Search

Notices

23.M.7 Updated

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 08-05-2023 | 07:10 PM
  #291  
Bus driver
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 888
Likes: 6
Default

Originally Posted by Snapdragon
The reroute in question happened in July, so wasn’t covered by the new rules. But yes the pay did show almost immediately with no intervention on my part.
Ahh, Bach! Thanks
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 06:59 AM
  #292  
crewdawg's Avatar
Moderator
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,342
Likes: 347
Default

We really need better better protections for GS assignments, especially for reserves. Woken up at 0200 (30 of us), which I was ok with since I could actually be awarded it. I hit accept and acknowledged it in ARCOS. The trip showed on my schedule and even had the proper PB days placed (50/50 on that usually). Woke up to get ready, and only checked my schedule to look at something else, and the trip was gone. Look back and my schedules says removed because they skipped a SC. To me, them not doing their due diligence and ensuring they checked for reserves available should be the cost of doing business. Maybe then they wouldn't be in such a hurry to send it to so many pilots, especially when you're waking pilots up in the middle of the night.
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 07:05 AM
  #293  
FangsF15's Avatar
Moderator
 
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 8,099
Likes: 1,047
Default

Originally Posted by crewdawg
We really need better better protections for GS assignments, especially for reserves. Woken up at 0200 (30 of us), which I was ok with since I could actually be awarded it. I hit accept and acknowledged it in ARCOS. The trip showed on my schedule and even had the proper PB days placed (50/50 on that usually). Woke up to get ready, and only checked my schedule to look at something else, and the trip was gone. Look back and my schedules says removed because they skipped a SC. To me, them not doing their due diligence and ensuring they checked for reserves available should be the cost of doing business. Maybe then they wouldn't be in such a hurry to send it to so many pilots, especially when you're waking pilots up in the middle of the night.
This is on my list of things to fix in the next contract. As a Reg, you would be guaranteed single pay. As a Res, you get nothing.

Therefore I submit we should "Establish Reserve Rotation Guarantee". Once it hits your schedule, you should be guaranteed the pay and/or credit.
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 07:41 AM
  #294  
crewdawg's Avatar
Moderator
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,342
Likes: 347
Default

Originally Posted by FangsF15
This is on my list of things to fix in the next contract. As a Reg, you would be guaranteed single pay. As a Res, you get nothing.

Therefore I submit we should "Establish Reserve Rotation Guarantee". Once it hits your schedule, you should be guaranteed the pay and/or credit.

You're only guaranteed it within 2 hours of report per 23.Q.12, which is the justification they used to remove it. Striking 23.Q.12 would be a great start. Either way, both line and reserves should have the same protections. If it goes out to ARCOS for GS coverage (especially if you start waking people up), it someone should at least get pay/credit for the trip.
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 09:04 AM
  #295  
FangsF15's Avatar
Moderator
 
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 8,099
Likes: 1,047
Default

Originally Posted by crewdawg
You're only guaranteed it within 2 hours of report per 23.Q.12, which is the justification they used to remove it. Striking 23.Q.12 would be a great start. Either way, both line and reserves should have the same protections. If it goes out to ARCOS for GS coverage (especially if you start waking people up), it someone should at least get pay/credit for the trip.
Harrrrumph!!
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 12:34 PM
  #296  
Line Holder
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 894
Likes: 49
From: B737 FO
Default

Originally Posted by crewdawg
We really need better better protections for GS assignments, especially for reserves. Woken up at 0200 (30 of us), which I was ok with since I could actually be awarded it. I hit accept and acknowledged it in ARCOS. The trip showed on my schedule and even had the proper PB days placed (50/50 on that usually). Woke up to get ready, and only checked my schedule to look at something else, and the trip was gone. Look back and my schedules says removed because they skipped a SC. To me, them not doing their due diligence and ensuring they checked for reserves available should be the cost of doing business. Maybe then they wouldn't be in such a hurry to send it to so many pilots, especially when you're waking pilots up in the middle of the night.
That is not cool. It's bad enough when it NOOPs but when it's their own mistake and you wake up super early for nothing that hurts!
Reply
Old 08-07-2023 | 12:47 PM
  #297  
LumberJack's Avatar
Coverage Award...
Community Favorite
Loved
5 Years
20 Countries Visited
 
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,690
Likes: 105
Default

Originally Posted by crewdawg
We really need better better protections for GS assignments, especially for reserves. Woken up at 0200 (30 of us), which I was ok with since I could actually be awarded it. I hit accept and acknowledged it in ARCOS. The trip showed on my schedule and even had the proper PB days placed (50/50 on that usually). Woke up to get ready, and only checked my schedule to look at something else, and the trip was gone. Look back and my schedules says removed because they skipped a SC. To me, them not doing their due diligence and ensuring they checked for reserves available should be the cost of doing business. Maybe then they wouldn't be in such a hurry to send it to so many pilots, especially when you're waking pilots up in the middle of the night.
I agree. Once it's on your schedule it should be guaranteed pay/credit. We adjust our lives for trips that are on our schedule.
Reply
Old 08-10-2023 | 08:49 AM
  #298  
Gets Weekends Off
Liked
25M+ Airline Miles
Line Holder
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 12,821
Likes: 153
From: window seat
Default

Originally Posted by Snapdragon
The reroute in question happened in July, so wasn’t covered by the new rules. But yes the pay did show almost immediately with no intervention on my part.
Most AUG RR's that I've done/seen have not gone on timecard or even RR on the monthly schedule. Supposedly they're all "hand reviewed" now and the consensus is that takes 2+ weeks. Some rotations actually DROP in credit (if the RR takes a hard fly trip down to an ADG trip) and all there may or may not be is a vague comment burried in the rotation itself.

This will either be a well oiled machine with a company SME on the case in a week or two, or it will be a "deny deny deny" and get paid 6 months later after you can prove it scenario once we break the April ACE backlog.

Good thing we're playing footsie refunding 0.05% dues.
Reply
Old 08-10-2023 | 09:08 AM
  #299  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 12,363
Likes: 904
Default

Originally Posted by gloopy
Most AUG RR's that I've done/seen have not gone on timecard or even RR on the monthly schedule. Supposedly they're all "hand reviewed" now and the consensus is that takes 2+ weeks. Some rotations actually DROP in credit (if the RR takes a hard fly trip down to an ADG trip) and all there may or may not be is a vague comment burried in the rotation itself.

This will either be a well oiled machine with a company SME on the case in a week or two, or it will be a "deny deny deny" and get paid 6 months later after you can prove it scenario once we break the April ACE backlog.

Good thing we're playing footsie refunding 0.05% dues.
ALPA simplifies all reroute calculations so that 100% of reroutes pay premium.

Pilots: Thanks ALPA for "letting" them pay us less!!
Reply
Old 08-10-2023 | 12:24 PM
  #300  
NuGuy's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,093
Likes: 82
Default

Originally Posted by gloopy
Most AUG RR's that I've done/seen have not gone on timecard or even RR on the monthly schedule. Supposedly they're all "hand reviewed" now and the consensus is that takes 2+ weeks. Some rotations actually DROP in credit (if the RR takes a hard fly trip down to an ADG trip) and all there may or may not be is a vague comment burried in the rotation itself.

This will either be a well oiled machine with a company SME on the case in a week or two, or it will be a "deny deny deny" and get paid 6 months later after you can prove it scenario once we break the April ACE backlog.

Good thing we're playing footsie refunding 0.05% dues.
The general problem with reroute and how it interacts with the time card is because of ancient technology and the patchwork of reroute rules over the years. DBMS never really caught up, which is why there isn’t a “unified” or even “coherent” display of reroute pay.

Reroute pay for getting back late (23 L8/9) came first, then that is why it has its own little spot on the time card and little RR notations on the schedule display. It’s been around long enough for DBMS to catch up and is kinda automated.

Mid rotation reroute end state (pre-2019) came much later, with a much more painful history of language and grievance settlements. That’s why there is no automation for it, and they have to figure it manually. When they finally get around to paying it, it’s this obscure status code like 4F1R.

The first mistake people make is that reroute pay is just reroute pay. There are different triggers and different pay treatments depending on the exact nature of the reroute. The second is assuming the person explaining it is correct, which while with good intentions, isn’t always the case. The best thing to do is go to the source.

I agree that reroute pay, all reroute pay, should be clearly itemized on the time card. The new L4 language should also facilitate automation.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Excargodog
COVID19
70
11-26-2021 08:01 AM
RBZL
Part 135
481
03-13-2020 10:02 AM
purplepilot
Cargo
35
09-13-2007 04:00 AM
HSLD
Major
0
11-18-2005 01:46 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



Your Privacy Choices