Originally Posted by DeadHead

Let me guess....Your using your brother in laws account because your currently out of the country, right?

Originally Posted by DeadHead

Well said Denny,

The reduction in profit sharing for next contract was merely only a theory of mine for the past few months, but seeing certain comments being communicated by DALPA it appears as though it's becoming a reality.

My guess is we will see a reduction from 20% down to 15% for everything above $2.5 billion in profits, or we will see the threshold moved from $2.5 billion up to $5 billion. The latter would be praised as a non-reduction in profit sharing percentages, while the former will be communicated as minimal change in take home amount from the preceeding 2-3 years.

This is just a theory of mine based on, hopefully im way off. Scary thing is, I think most of our guys might be tricked by this foolery.

Originally Posted by IAV84DAL

Thanks for the warm welcome. Don't call it a comeback, I've been here for years. But I'm new to the forum true enough.

TIA to anyone who can steer me to changing "New Hire" in my profile to "Line Holder" or something more appropriate, and although I've uploaded an avatar, its not being presented. Any idea why??

Originally Posted by shiznit

It's only "foolery" if we don't extract that change as payrate percentages ABOVE what a standalone negotiation would produce.

You can't touch the 20% IMO, it is an unlimited number, so it can't really be quantified, hence how do you trade for an unqantifiable?

Changing the threshold for the 10%-20% is an easily calculated number. Pilots end up with just over 1/3 of the total.

2.5B-5B x 20% = 500M * 35% = $175M

2.5B-5B x 10% = 250M * 35% = 87.5M

Using DH's scenario,

If the Company wants to discuss moving at least $87.5 million into a less risky portion of our PWA, ON TOP OF our negotiated increases for this Section 6, I'm all ears.

If the Company wants to do it and substitute it for part of our "pay raise", NFW.

Originally Posted by IAV84DAL

I'm actually encouraged.

Originally Posted by shiznit

It's only "foolery" if we don't extract that change as payrate percentages ABOVE what a standalone negotiation would produce.

You can't touch the 20% IMO, it is an unlimited number, so it can't really be quantified, hence how do you trade for an unqantifiable?

Changing the threshold for the 10%-20% is an easily calculated number. Pilots end up with just over 1/3 of the total.

2.5B-5B x 20% = 500M * 35% = $175M

2.5B-5B x 10% = 250M * 35% = 87.5M

Using DH's scenario,

If the Company wants to discuss moving at least $87.5 million into a less risky portion of our PWA, ON TOP OF our negotiated increases for this Section 6, I'm all ears.

If the Company wants to do it and substitute it for part of our "pay raise", NFW.

Originally Posted by IAV84DAL

Gentlemen,


Thank you in advance for you time. As we near the mid February date of disbursal for 2014 profit sharing each of us is made more aware of the role it plays in our total compensation. The percentage of total profit sharing payout for myself equates to nearly 2 months pay. Extracting this significant benefit during such a profitable period for our industry will be an unenviable task. I am aware that efforts to achieve significant pay and contractual improvements may involve some kind of reduction to or even the elimination of profit sharing. I approve of that negotiated outcome, let me tell you why.


I've never been a fan of profit sharing. My skillset is in time and risk management. An efficiency expert if you will. My compensation should never have been tied to management's ability to coerce a profit from the operation. The idea was ill advised in concept and even worse in practice because the formula for disbursement is based solely on W2. The profit generating productivity of a pilot working 80 hours for straight pay is discounted in comparison to a pilot working equal or less hours flying green slips.


I personally find the eventual sunset on Profit Sharing a breath of fresh air. Relief at long last from an obscene plot that remunerated a select few Super Premium or Green Slip opportunists while the majority of your constituents stand outside looking in. So hats off to you in your efforts to dismantle the Frankenstein we should never have birthed.


Of course its never as easy as just shutting it down because its the right thing to do. No, there will be plenty of push back from the usual suspects who view any form of profit sharing reduction as a concession and from those select few who profit the most from its inequitable application. But in the event that you are successful in this endeavor we should at least visit an alternative that might act as panacea to the idea of eliminating profit sharing altogether.


I propose the purchase of an Annuity/Retirement product for every pilot at the airline starting on his date of hire. The company would make an annual payment of $5,000 per pilot employee toward that annuity irrespective of position flown, hours worked or corporate profitability. This per capita model would offer an equitable and substantial supplemental retirement plan which would offset in large part the cost for the membership retiring the profit sharing model and make room for contractual improvements including raises in rates of pay.


I cannot stress enough the importance of crafting a per capita model. The emphasis here must be on decoupling profit sharing from W2 and replacing that model with one that fairly distributes a contractual benefit for all. Any effort to construct a model that disproportionally rewards position, equipment, longevity or W2 perpetuates a shameless scheme already in place which since we've all acquiesced to might be left well enough alone.


Best of Luck,

TJG

Originally Posted by IAV84DAL

2 planes evacuated in Seattle, another diverted to Dallas. Looking for details.