Well im not sure but I do know that this didn't cause any deaths.


but CNN is standing by in case things change.

unless all of the Iraq and Afghanistan veterans start to loot again in Baltimore then they will cover that.


unless the white house correspondents dinner is going on again then they will trump all for that.




:D

Sailing,

I think people were screaming that were would require less pilots because of certain provisions/concessions. (Ie., Higher ALV's, reserve cap, etc.) ALPA even came out with a memo that said so, didn't they?

I don't remember anyone on here screaming furloughs. If there was, it was just a few.

Yeah I don't recall furlough talk either, but we were reducing pilots required.

Ashamed of what? You said

If, you're loving it, I just assumed you were appreciative of those that worked on your behalf to make it so. I guess not.

daily Call to Action reminder..takes just a few seconds of our time. I was on the jumpseat with an ALPA rep the other day and only 3000ish people have sent one. Easy to do.

Dude, you need to be anchoring a desk on some network.:D

Pretty much nailed it!

ALPA did come out and explain exactly what the job loss worst case would be. Their number was a net number looking at the various trade offs. In the areas where we gave up jobs we asked and got offsets in other areas. The net effect was a loss of about 150 jobs system wide. The forum claimed the number was far in excess of that. Block hours compared to headcount show that number to be accurate if not a little pessimistic. Crew planning made no changes in manning assumptions.

Why have a trade off on work rules to begin with? Especially with productivity? AND to such a level that Ed claimed it was a way to pay for C2012?

I not sure but I'm willing to give it a taste!!

Cannot stop laughing.

You quoted 80... from 2007.

Through sheer bad luck, I'm going to exhaust my allotment of sick time this year. I know it resets June 1, but is there anything to do to not lose pay after exhausting it? I will have gone over about 10 hours. Do I just lose 10 hours credit/pay?

Ed never claimed that. This was hashed out over and over again. The companies claim to Wallstreet when asked how they could afford the contract was that all the changes with the refleeting being the biggest would pay for the contractual improvements via increased revenue and productivity. You need only look at the quarterly reports to see how much pilot costs have gone up since the start of the contract. They certainly have not stayed the same.
As far as offsets there were something like 5 or 6. The big two were reducing when a reserve was full and counting vacations and all known absences when determine full status. Others included increased training and vacation pay and the increase in sick leave. The sick leave part turned out to be far greater then the company expected hence their current fixation with that subject.

If it's only 10 hours, you can use your bank to fill up. You guys need to learn about the bank, I'm telling you) If you are going to be out for awhile you can go on ST disability and get it recharged. I think. I would call Karen Browne Fleck at dALPA and talk to her about it though. I had a similar thing happen a few years back, and I had knee surgery on the last weekend of May to get that recharged. I might be giving you old information, so call Ms Browne-Fleck. You might have to leave a voice mail, but she'll get back to you.

Do not rely on the Forum for this. Call 1 800 USA ALPA and ask for Karen Fleck. There is no way to even attempt to answer the question with the limited info you gave.

There are guys out there who keep carefully archived posts, from this and other forums, going back much further than that. One guy copied a post from a forum he didn't even have access to over on "the other board" from before the merger.

Not sure to what end someone needs to "archive" stuff like that. But everyone needs a hobby, I guess.

Nu

Do you really expect an answer to that?....:rolleyes:

Tastes like Chicken

The largest offset in job loss was supposed to be the early retirement program. As I recall less than a third of those expected to, actually took it.

Early retirement programs aren't worth the paper they are printed on. Ever.

I will agree with Carl when he is correct (which is almost never), but.... Why does a guy leave because he hates this place and then come back... as a different poster... but spouting the exact p.o.v. as his previous incarnation? What's the point? Is he embarrassed at not being able to stay away? I'm with Carl. Why not bring back TSquare?

Perhaps he just wanted to be born again. A do over. A new start. Our maybe the Dixie Mafia was closing in. Never double down on the Vols - three weeks in a row.

amen

total waste of time

You've made yourself look like even more of a fool than usual. Impressive!

But as sailing said back then, it didn't matter since they were higher value retirements. :)

Cue no hiring for a year and a half after that...

Ed never did say that, you're right, Ed championed the reduced profit sharing as a cost savings measure to make the contract affordable.

It was Richard Anderson that said it.

Not sure when this was "hashed out" but in reference to the productivity above he was talking about the PWA, not re-fleeting productivity. We didn't build any fleet productivity into the PWA and he wasn't talking about the agreement with SWA. The reporter had asked about our contract and so he was referring to our contract when he said refleeting and improved productivity to help pay for C2012.

Then Ed jumped in about PS.

Now you've really outed yourself.

Which is really ironic given the emails to me saying how the forums are toxic and so on and so forth. :)

Let's really test this.

http://a1.fssta.com/content/dam/fsdi...620.high.0.jpg

Not only that, we were still in bankruptcy for another 6 days after that post!

Go back and take a look at the Touch and Gos chart projections if we accept ta or not.

Total crap.

There was one "early retirement program" that worked like a charm; an approaching threat to the lump sum option. Anybody loafing near the exit door around 2003 would have been trampled. :rolleyes:

Can we play the identification game again?

http://rs938.pbsrc.com/albums/ad230/...0?t=1430251409

How many of these do we have to do? I have done a lot this year, wont another one fall on deaf ears?? They get the same "crafted" letter 3000 times or more.

Ok, submitted again. Playing this silly game. Of course we want our jobs.:rolleyes:

TEN

Does it help? Who knows

Can it hurt? Nope.

I fill them out because I have seen (first hand) politicians inquire as to how many of our members support a given issue. It gives our government affairs guys more ammo when they are in there dealing with (sometimes) irrational, (nearly always) short-sighted, self-serving politicians that only seek to please the highest bidder OR the one that can offer them votes/influence/support.

We are at a severe disadvantage in DC because "they" will always have deeper pockets. We need every edge we can get, and then it still might not be enough.

Good on you Diesel for seeing the importance of these issues, even as a "Delta noooob." I think we may have met about a month ago. War Eagle?:D

Ten, thanks for filling it out again. It is a pita, but worth our time.

That's a Mitsubishi "Tool Bag."

As many as it takes, right? We need to be like Andy Dufresne: Dear Mr. Dufresne, here are your books, but for God's sake quit writing us.

Andy Dufresne? Same Andy Dufresne that were abused by the Sisters down in the laundry? The guy that spent all that time down in solitary and was hung by the shirt collar four stories up. The Andy that was rich lawyer and then a forgotten convict? The one that crawled through a mile of human dung? The poor soul that caught Susan Sarandon on the downside? No, I don't want to be like Andy.

I got a robo call from our MEC chair about the ME Carriers Call to action. He was very passionate and fired up about this! I realize this is a threat and we need to address it.

I just wish his message on 2015 was as passionate and fired up! The communication from him on our negotiations sounds like we already lost.

IMHO contract 2012 2.0 is around the corner.

Some of our politicians are still fighting the good fight. I know my representative personally. He is often under attack because he's not on the take. He is a signer of our fair open skies letter. A republican and a legitimately good and smart man.

Yes he did fud. The only reason it keeps getting rehashed is because you deny the quotes and the truth. Why you do this, is another question.

Incorrect. Ed and Richard stated in multiple documents (posted right here on APC years ago) that the pilots 2012 contract was cost neutral and that the savings would allow Delta to invest in initiatives that benefit other employees at Delta.

As you well know, the quarterly reports don't state pilot costs.

Intersting that you use the word "offsets." Does everyone see how clever that is? What he really means is concessions. The work rule, sick leave and scope concessions coupled with the profit sharing concessions is what allowed management to make the accurate claim that our 2012 contract was cost neutral.

Carl

Ok Carl, so how do you explain the huge increase in pilot costs over the last 3 years or is Delta management forging their financial reports?