Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Major > Delta
Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? >

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Search

Notices

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 02-18-2011 | 07:14 AM
  #59861  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,113
Likes: 0
Default

I read JG's memo as setting up the policy so that the number of times you use it should be proportional to the number of times flights are cancelled, or you're not boarded, for reasons outside of your control. I also read it to mean that it shouldn't be abused by the few, because it could place the entire policy in jeopardy.

Then I realized he could have done everything he needed to accomplish by simply stating that "the policy is not a substitute for good planning, and is not expected to be used routinely..." and it would have been nice if he stopped at adding "but we hope you find this mutually benefficial change will lessen the stress of your commute".

I'm not a commuter, but I am a professional. I do expect to be given policy and procedures, as well as their limitations, and to be trusted to operate within the limitations. I don't want a speech tailored to the 1-2% among us, and I resent the not-so-subtle implication that the default setting is for pilots to abuse the system.

As far as labor relations, and the "recovery compact" stuff, this is an epic fail. I would like to see, at a minimum, some comment from the union indicating the tone is unsat. It would be interesting to see if we'd have the nerve to send this back, since it conflicts with our contract. It can be agreed to, minus the b.s., and included as a LOA.
Old 02-18-2011 | 07:39 AM
  #59862  
Nosmo King's Avatar
Inventory survival kit ..
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,069
Likes: 0
From: Seeking no jacket required rotations
Default

Originally Posted by Sink r8
I read JG's memo as setting up the policy so that the number of times you use it should be proportional to the number of times flights are cancelled, or you're not boarded, for reasons outside of your control. I also read it to mean that it shouldn't be abused by the few, because it could place the entire policy in jeopardy.

Then I realized he could have done everything he needed to accomplish by simply stating that "the policy is not a substitute for good planning, and is not expected to be used routinely..." and it would have been nice if he stopped at adding "but we hope you find this mutually benefficial change will lessen the stress of your commute".

I'm not a commuter, but I am a professional. I do expect to be given policy and procedures, as well as their limitations, and to be trusted to operate within the limitations. I don't want a speech tailored to the 1-2% among us, and I resent the not-so-subtle implication that the default setting is for pilots to abuse the system.

As far as labor relations, and the "recovery compact" stuff, this is an epic fail. I would like to see, at a minimum, some comment from the union indicating the tone is unsat. It would be interesting to see if we'd have the nerve to send this back, since it conflicts with our contract. It can be agreed to, minus the b.s., and included as a LOA.
If it's an LOA/MOU then it cannot be unilaterally terminated. I think that is the why they leave it as a policy for the reasons stated in the bulletin. I'll see if I can dig up the original bulletin at fNW. IIRC the commentary wasn't quite as loaded as the current version.

Still waiting for someone to tell me where this is written in the PWA, I'm having a hell of a time finding it...
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:04 AM
  #59863  
scambo1's Avatar
The Brown Dot +1
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,775
Likes: 0
From: 777B
Default

Originally Posted by Check Essential
Chuck-
Its kinda complex, but here's the short version--

The Delta, Northwest, United and USAir pilots all received certain distributions of cash following bankruptcy. In some cases the distribution was substantial.
That money was all taxed as ordinary income.
The gov't. did make a 1 time exemption to the income limits for contributions to Roth IRAs but it still was counted as ordinary income.
This new law will allow the funds to be treated as if they were roll-overs to regular IRA accounts which means there would be no income tax due.
That means those of us who received those distributions can now convert them to regular IRAs and get a BIG tax refund.

Its only fair. We lost our entire pension in those bankruptcies.

Check;

As I read it, you have to have paid the tax on those earnings in the payout year and now have to go back and amend that tax return to get the benefit. Is that how you read it?
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:08 AM
  #59864  
iaflyer's Avatar
seeing the country...
15 Years
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,015
Likes: 41
From: 73N A
Default

Originally Posted by Nosmo King
Still waiting for someone to tell me where this is written in the PWA, I'm having a hell of a time finding it...
Sec 23, Y.

I tried cut/pasting it here, but it comes out looking all weird. It does say "It is expected that a pilot will avail himself of Section 23 Y. 2. on a rare basis." so that line isn't new. It also says, "A pilot who has demonstrated a pattern of inability to report as scheduled will be subject to progressive disciplinary action."

The new policy is nice in that 2 hours aren't required between your primary and backup flight.
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:09 AM
  #59865  
scambo1's Avatar
The Brown Dot +1
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,775
Likes: 0
From: 777B
Default

Originally Posted by Nosmo King
If it's an LOA/MOU then it cannot be unilaterally terminated. I think that is the why they leave it as a policy for the reasons stated in the bulletin. I'll see if I can dig up the original bulletin at fNW. IIRC the commentary wasn't quite as loaded as the current version.

Still waiting for someone to tell me where this is written in the PWA, I'm having a hell of a time finding it...

disregard........
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:21 AM
  #59866  
Check Essential's Avatar
Works Every Weekend
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,506
Likes: 0
From: 737 ATL
Default

Originally Posted by scambo1
Check;

As I read it, you have to have paid the tax on those earnings in the payout year and now have to go back and amend that tax return to get the benefit. Is that how you read it?
Yup. I read it the same.
You will essentially be amending your return for they year you got the payments.
The mechanics of that is yet to be determined.
I've never filed an amended return. I have no idea how it will work.
Hopefully they will just create a special form for us and we won't have to go back and redo the whole tax return. Yikes!
I can't even remember what year we got that notes and claims money. 2007 maybe?
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:36 AM
  #59867  
Banned
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,007
Likes: 0
From: Space Shuttle PIC
Default

Originally Posted by Check Essential
Chuck-
Its kinda complex, but here's the short version--

The Delta, Northwest, United and USAir pilots all received certain distributions of cash following bankruptcy. In some cases the distribution was substantial.
That money was all taxed as ordinary income.
The gov't. did make a 1 time exemption to the income limits for contributions to Roth IRAs but it still was counted as ordinary income.
This new law will allow the funds to be treated as if they were roll-overs to regular IRA accounts which means there would be no income tax due.
That means those of us who received those distributions can now convert them to regular IRAs and get a BIG tax refund.

Its only fair. We lost our entire pension in those bankruptcies.


How does someone figure out how to get that money? Will there be a step by step process?
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:54 AM
  #59868  
Moderator
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,263
Likes: 105
From: DAL 330
Default Devils Advocate Post

Originally Posted by iaflyer
For those of you betting how long it would take the FAs to get the same commuting policy, how many people had "0 days"?

Yesterday, they got the same exact policy as we did.

Guys,

I agree that we shouldn't have to worry about the FAs or any other employee group when negotiating, but I don't see an issue here for two reasons:

First - its policy and not contractual. I sure hope we didn't burn any bargaining leverage on a policy that can be unilaterally terminated.

Second - If it helps the company run smoother by getting employees into position wouldn't it be better to include all employee groups that commute?

Scoop
Old 02-18-2011 | 08:56 AM
  #59869  
Check Essential's Avatar
Works Every Weekend
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,506
Likes: 0
From: 737 ATL
Default

Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg
How does someone figure out how to get that money? Will there be a step by step process?
It still has to pass the House of Representatives.
Getting it in the Senate bill was the big hurdle though.

I expect guidance from the govt and the union as soon as it becomes final.
Old 02-18-2011 | 09:53 AM
  #59870  
Nosmo King's Avatar
Inventory survival kit ..
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,069
Likes: 0
From: Seeking no jacket required rotations
Default

Originally Posted by Scoop
Guys,

I agree that we shouldn't have to worry about the FAs or any other employee group when negotiating, but I don't see an issue here for two reasons:

First - its policy and not contractual. I sure hope we didn't burn any bargaining leverage on a policy that can be unilaterally terminated.

Second - If it helps the company run smoother by getting employees into position wouldn't it be better to include all employee groups that commute?

Scoop
If the letter had not mentioned "cost to the company" then I think this would be a non_issue. If the added cost of adding flight attendants to this policy ends up being a reason to endit, then it will be a case of "me too" blues.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
On Autopilot
Regional
22617
11-05-2021 07:03 AM
AeroCrewSolut
Delta
153
08-14-2018 12:18 PM
Bill Lumberg
Major
71
06-13-2012 08:36 AM
Quagmire
Major
253
04-16-2011 06:19 AM
JiffyLube
Major
12
03-07-2008 04:27 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



Your Privacy Choices