P-KB4? That notation hasn't been used in 30 years. It would be f4 now. (or f5 if black)

And I'd pick Magnus Carlsen over Kasparov.

 

What can I say, I like the old notation better. The "new" notation is not nearly as sexy.

 

We will say NO to the next one. And the next one. They can not insult us anymore with ridiculous offers. This TA shows me that the Association and the Company know we are push-overs. It is time for us to politely yet in a stern unified VOICE tell them that we are asking for more pay, retirement, better work-rules etc. NO MORE RIDICULOUS CONCESSIONS!

I voted NO for C2012 because I knew the ridiculous offers would keep on coming. Once in a while in Business, you have to push back. There is no room for "what-ifs". TA2015 is dangerous and is part of our career degradation that started with C2012, RA and EB. We are pilots, we are worth more and you cant run an airline without us, plain and simple. This goes to all the other Global AIrlines as well.

No more concessions. This RA character is truly morphing us into a travel agency. We will wake up one day, with a minuscule amount of International Flying doused with work rules that compare to Mesa Airlines, while RA is relaxed in retirement enjoying his millions.

I will not be part of the extinction of our careers. I wonder how the 11 reps sleep at night?

TEN
VOTE NO

 

Do I have to keep saying no until you are satisfied? Just let me know, because apparently your opinion is the only one that matters.

 

JV - since the contract was opened, we can't have a TA where one of the parties is out of compliance. I think staying with EASKs is important. So compliance for the company drops in any TA to what they are at. No block hours. The AF KLM JV agreement delta signed with those companies is 50% +/- 5%. EASKs encourage bigger metal. Additionally, EASKs if replicated in Asia encourages bigger metal or much more small metal. We have to protect ourselves here.

OE trip pulls. Nonstarter. Goes away. Poof. Can't have it. Seniority is sacred, abrogation of seniority is off the table.

Sick. It's a tough nut to come up with a policy that works for IMSAFE and is not viewed by some as a "use or lose" program. Those are the end zone brackets. I like what we have. If you're sick enough to go to the doctor, get it verified. If you have a cold or the squirts you don't. This whole program in the TA isn't even finalized by either the company or the union. It's punitive to the masses and doesn't fix anything.

Pay. 20%, 3%, 3%. After that, we can monetize all profit sharing. We keep raising the profit sharing ptix threshold to keep us from getting the maximum benefit that was originally negotiated. We did it in c12 and we're doing it in ta15. Monetize it after getting the pay.

Vacation add a week for everyone. Pay it at daily value.

Training. Paid at daily value.

E190/5 TAd rate is fine as far as I'm concerned.

How do we get there? Vote this TA down first.

 

Im going to use AA's non section 6 "negotiations" as an example, although our situation is far better than theirs. AA's BOD (MEC equivalent) rejected managements "last best final offer" 3 times before the last one went to vote. Each time the offer came back with an additional carrot. If you remember, the first thing management had to remove from the offer was their insanely bad scope language. They tried to throw a ridiculous scope concession in there and it was immediately rejected. At any rate, AA pilots did not "Win" overall, since it wasn't even section 6 and a mandatory arbitration date was coming rapidly. However, they did not fall for the trick of taking the first offer and the deceptive and dangerous language of that first offer. So in essence, they minimized the pain of a mandated jcba by rejecting some pretty important concessions.

Our situation looks even better. We don't have mandatory arbitration. We're in section 6. We have 6 more months, then another 3 before we even file for mediation. We say no until we're fully satisfied with the language. For most of us unfortunately that's just a few tweaks here and there. We're not going to win a massive victory here, since expectations have already been lowered. We're just going to establish a line in the sand that they will know not to cross. It will be huge for us even keeping the QOL concessions that are on the table right now. Very attainable, very reasonable. Worth waiting for the pay raises.

 

We do not dictate what kind of airplane DAL buys. You want bigger pays more. Block hours is better protection until we get that. I agree that the immediate allowance to 49% is heinous.

I am not going to really get into this one, but I do find it interesting that when we had the June reload, sick leave in May spiked (so I am told) Take that fwiw. I don't really like this new thing, but I can live with it. When I am sick, I call in sick. A better solution might be to make getting a day off when reserve coverage is capped more reasonable. Life events are important, and with current manning shortages, there are times when sick leave is what gets used. Not justifying it, I understand it.

That is what SHOULD have happened, I agree. It didn't. And it probably won't f we vote this down until it loses it's value to the company. jmho.

I'd rather have more per day than more days personally.

Yup.

. Another one we agree on.

Maybe

 

American lost tons of earnings when they folded arms and said no. Don't believe me. Ask them yourself. They will never be able to make up that money that was not in their bank accounts. Don't believe TVM if you don't want. I'll be happy to call Mr Buffett and let him know what an idiot you think he is.

Disclaimer: Not selling anything, but you brought up TVM.

So at what point can I vote yes?

 

We have bigger pays more.

The immediate allowance to 49% is bad, but the company played us on this one. We can't TA an agreement with one side out of compliance. They paid their $30M fine and then opened the contract fully aware that it would reset them to the lower limit.

BHs is only downside protection. And then not really.

How about 50% EASKs or 50% BHs whichever is higher?

 

That sounds fine to me. I don't like the immediate BH allowance to 49%. At all. That is huge imho.

How about LGBP, and then BH?