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JamesBond 04-30-2016 06:39 AM


Originally Posted by Xray678 (Post 2119644)
No matter what pay system we have, the pie will not get bigger. So to pay everyone the top rate you will have to cut somewhere else. There is no way to pay more people the 777A rate and keep that rate the same.

Not true. You do it in stages, and the super premium guys' pay increases are just not as big (percentage wise) as everybody elses' Tough. They have been at the top of the food chain longer than anybody else will be there.

"The needs of the many."

freightguy 04-30-2016 06:47 AM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 2119688)
Not true. You do it in stages, and the super premium guys' pay increases are just not as big (percentage wise) as everybody elses' Tough. They have been at the top of the food chain longer than anybody else will be there.

"The needs of the many."

As the legacy with the least amount of big widebodies (we will be using the second tier pay A330s for most international), pay banding makes more and more sense. Band B777, B747, A330 and B767-400 pay together. Just like United. Or similar. Then we won't have to sit here and cry that we don't have the number of 777s others have.

Falcon7 04-30-2016 06:52 AM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 2119529)
Edit: And another thing. If, as you say, the world trend is upgauging then the whole BH conversion in FTA 15 was a really really bad idea. So which is it?

I believe the trend at DAL is upgauging, not so much at AF, particularly with all of AF's 747s being parked.

Falcon7 04-30-2016 06:53 AM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 2119688)
Not true. You do it in stages, and the super premium guys' pay increases are just not as big (percentage wise) as everybody elses' Tough. They have been at the top of the food chain longer than anybody else will be there.

"The needs of the many."

Bring a resolution to your next council meeting asking for pay banding.

JamesBond 04-30-2016 06:55 AM


Originally Posted by Falcon7 (Post 2119698)
I believe the trend at DAL is upgauging, not so much at AF, particularly with all of AF's 747s being parked.

So then the block hour metric would make more sense.

Originally Posted by Falcon7 (Post 2119703)
Bring a resolution to your next council meeting asking for pay banding.

My reps know exactly how I feel on this. So does Heiko. We have talked in the past about it. The young guys that will be most affected by this change need to be more vocal about it.

JamesBond 04-30-2016 06:59 AM


Originally Posted by freightguy (Post 2119694)
As the legacy with the least amount of big widebodies (we will be using the second tier pay A330s for most international), pay banding makes more and more sense. Band B777, B747, A330 and B767-400 pay together. Just like United. Or similar. Then we won't have to sit here and cry that we don't have the number of 777s others have.

Stand by for incoming.

Falcon7 04-30-2016 07:09 AM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 2119705)
My reps know exactly how I feel on this. So does Heiko. We have talked in the past about it. The young guys that will be most affected by this change need to be more vocal about it.

I'm glad you spoke to your reps about it, but if you feel strongly about it a local council resolution, supported by your council at a meeting, and brought by your reps to the MEC will carry more weight.

JamesBond 04-30-2016 07:19 AM


Originally Posted by Falcon7 (Post 2119713)
I'm glad you spoke to your reps about it, but if you feel strongly about it a local council resolution, supported by your council at a meeting, and brought by your reps to the MEC will carry more weight.

NYC based and I commute 2 hours by plane. Sorry, but commuting in to do that just ain't in the cards unless it is in conjunction with a trip. Like I said, it will affect the junior guys far far more than it will me. They need to pick up this particular ball and run with it.

Hank Kingsley 04-30-2016 07:28 AM

Snowballs chance in Miami Beach. Besides, you think Ed and the boys worry about how much stock they give each other.

notEnuf 04-30-2016 07:32 AM


Originally Posted by Falcon7 (Post 2119698)
I believe the trend at DAL is upgauging, not so much at AF, particularly with all of AF's 747s being parked.

What evidence do you have for that? The 50 seat RJs might be upgauging but our 744 leaving puts the 330 as the most seat dense airframe.


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