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Quote:

Originally Posted by vessbot (Post 2797200)

Yes it means exactly that, bring it to a stop.

NO it does NOT. just had this conversation with a check airman. Of course among themselves they also disagree. But "set" vs "SET" means set for the situation. Bleeds "set" does not mean bleeds on or off. Parking brake "set" does not mean parking brake "ON' or "OFF". Parking SET on the other hand would mean "ON"

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797209)

I dunno bro... "beacons on brakes released."

"brakes set you're clear to disconnect"

setting brakes essentially means they're on, just saying... bleeds set means they're configured properly for a given situation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797194)

Ok I know many of the users on APC just spew stupid stuff just to get a rise out of the reader maybe you are one of those guys.

That’s an opinion statement to which you can form your own.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797194)

So I will take the bait. There are many things I disagree with but I get PAID to run my ship the way the company dictates.

I run my ship in a safe, secure, legal, and only then efficient manner at my discretion. I get paid by the contract, where is this requirement in my contract? Oh it’s not? Where is my incentive to do this then? It’s does nothing to benefit me.

Your snowflake flame throwing put aside; this place is trending towards taking more and more, while giving less. All that despite doing better and better. Why should I go out of my way to help them get an extra 5%?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797194)

Ok I know many of the users on APC just spew stupid stuff just to get a rise out of the reader maybe you are one of those guys. So I will take the bait. There are many things I disagree with but I get PAID to run my ship the way the company dictates. Simple. No stress. As far as increasing your complexity, really? You are a professional, one step at a time, easy, done and dusted.

This middle seat argument going around, seriously snowflake's? Yes we should be given the same respect as our big brothers at daddy D but we are not. BoooooHooooo! Yes it sucks but I will leave it up to the union to fix and when I get a chance voce my displeasure to management, getting stuck in a middle seat, oh well, it's part of the job I get paid to do.

FOR 900 DRIVERS: Start Rant!!
To really throw fuel on the fire YES I do rolling cross bleed starts! (when cabin temp allows) Parking brake "Set" vs "SET" does not mean bring the aircraft to a stop, ensuring the parking brake is "ON" and watch the FO start the engine. I mean why should it be any different than a rolling start with the APU on? OH but its not safe! All that added thrust my damage the A380 behind you. The added thrust which is no greater than the thrust required to taxi on a singe engine and half the break away thrust just to get the ship moving is not going to damage the plane behind you and if it does THEY ARE TO CLOSE. Don't be that 900 driver in KLGA who requested a taxi to the deice pad so he could do a cross bleed start, that is skywest stupid. But then again the Complexity may creep up and scare a few off.

BTW single engine taxi + APU saves no Fuel. 74,000 + pounds single engine requires aprox 700+LBS/hr on the operating engine just to keep it rolling add the 200 LBS/hr on the APU and you have 900LBS/hr total which is really really close to the 1000LBS/hr it takes to taxi on both engines.

Rant Over

Absolutely spot on. Against SOP, yes. But spot on.a

It should be CROSS BLEED START:
Boost Pump.......ON
L ENG START......PUSH
THR LEVER.........IDLE
Complete.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meow1215 (Post 2797218)

That’s an opinion statement to which you can form your own.

I run my ship in a safe, secure, legal, and only then efficient manner at my discretion. I get paid by the contract, where is this requirement in my contract? Oh it’s not? Where is my incentive to do this then? It’s does nothing to benefit me.

Your snowflake flame throwing put aside; this place is trending towards taking more and more, while giving less. All that despite doing better and better. Why should I go out of my way to help them get an extra 5%?

I'll jump on your side when you show me in either the contact or company manual where you have the Discretion to decide what is or is not efficient? We get paid to operate according to the contract And company policies and guidelines.

You can be as salty as you want BUT our contract does not leave the Efficiency decision up to me nor does it leave it up to you. We get paid within the guide lines of our contract to follow the company rules.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797209)

LCP's are sometimes wrong about things, and if there's disagreement between them about a certain issue then that should be a hint that this issue is a prime candidate for a LCP being wrong about it.

Given that at all levels of training we're taught to do the crossbleed start stopped, and that at every other checklist where the brake is answered "set" it's obviously supposed to be on (unless you think it's at our discretion to leave it off at the shutdown checklist) that points to threre being an oversight in the consistency of the response scheme, and clearly "set" means "on" for the parking brake in general. It probably stems from that at some places where we're supposed to check the brake is on, the EICAS is not powered and there is no place to read "on," so all that's available to us is the handle position; so "set" it is.

If you're still not sure, why don't you write the Fleet Manager about it?

(Also all caps does not mean what you say. It means that that is the actual switch/button label or indication.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TalkTurkey (Post 2797225)

Absolutely spot on. Against SOP, yes. But spot on.a

It should be CROSS BLEED START:
Boost Pump.......ON
L ENG START......PUSH
THR LEVER.........IDLE
Complete.

It comes down to what the meaning of "Set" is. Unlike the preflight expanded checklist the cross bleed parking brake "set" DOES NOT say "PARKING BRAKE ON" advisory message posted.

For 30 years I have been taught SOP and parking brake set is how the captain wants it set, either ON or OFF depending on the situation. Yes the Preferred method is to taxi APU ON Right Engine ON. We did have a brief period of time where it was encouraged to single engine taxi APU off but I was told too many guys were starting the engine at idle giving hotter than normal starts.

Hope someone can find something that says different I would be more than happy say I was wrong.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2dubs (Post 2797226)

FOM 8-81
“A single engine taxi in and out preferred.”

7/9 CFM 3-5
It lacks “should”, “will”, “shall”, or “must”, meaning this is entirely optional.

I care more about my crew and passengers' comfort as well as my FO's workload than Delta's profit sharing.

If Delta wants us to care, give us profit sharing. Before all you flamers jump on me, I know the odds of that are about as bad as the odds of flow. I know management reads these though, so maybe they'll take it to heart. It's all cost and no benefit to us to work harder or cook ourselves/passengers being stingy with the APU or SET.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green Needles (Post 2797249)

you’re 100% right. Can’t wait to see the slide on the crew room tv touting the benefit to profit sharing, like last time this came up. How insensitive and insulting.