Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1846949)

35 CA vacancies, with now downgrades. This is the first pure vacancy notice in a long while. Endeavor has turned the corner new hires are showing up and now you will upgrade time drop like a rock. If you get hired today within 2 years you should have the opportunity.

Reasons for saying this

People leaving for Delta and other majors will continue to create movement.

First officers with CJO's at Delta will soon start moving there as early as next year and some will skip the upgrade now that the money part is there and they will enjoy the quality of life as a senior first officer before moving on to Delta.

The major airlines will start to look more closely at regional first officers again increasing attrition.

The company will be bring CRJ 200 back out of the desert in the fall to begin growing with the idea of being about 150 airplanes strong.

For those looking at which regional to go too consider Endeavor. Best money in the industry as well as the much needed upgrade to captain is coming.

Originally Posted by CAPTAINPCL (Post 1846974)

I agree with everything your saying here, it does seem like this place has turned around for the better and things are looking up. I'm just curious why you're such a cheerleader for Endeavor? It's not a bad thing, but you have always seemed to drink the koolaid in large doses.

Originally Posted by CAPTAINPCL (Post 1846974)

I agree with everything your saying here, it does seem like this place has turned around for the better and things are looking up. I'm just curious why you're such a cheerleader for Endeavor? It's not a bad thing, but you have always seemed to drink the koolaid in large doses.

Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1569831)

Something for new hires to consider. If you come to Endeavor now and upgrade in 18 months that's and 18 month upgrade if a current 6 yr FO does the same it was 7 years and 6 months. This creates understandable frustration from current pilots. This should however not dissuade you from coming to Endeavor senior pilots are leaving and this is causing movement. The pace at which we are parking aircraft is slow enough that attrition is beating it. Coming to Endeavor is not a bad choice especially if the bases are near your home.

Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1846949)

The company will be bring CRJ 200 back out of the desert in the fall

Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1847014)

If you get hired at a company as a street captain and a guy in your upgrade class has been there 4 years. Is upgrade 4 years or 0. My point was that upgrade time as a new hire needs to be measure by how long it will take for them to upgrade historical upgrade times are not a useful metric.

Originally Posted by CAPTAINPCL (Post 1846974)

I agree with everything your saying here, it does seem like this place has turned around for the better and things are looking up. I'm just curious why you're such a cheerleader for Endeavor? It's not a bad thing, but you have always seemed to drink the koolaid in large doses.

Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1846949)

Reasons for saying this

People leaving for Delta and other majors will continue to create movement.

First officers with CJO's at Delta will soon start moving there as early as next year and some will skip the upgrade now that the money part is there and they will enjoy the quality of life as a senior first officer before moving on to Delta.

The major airlines will start to look more closely at regional first officers again increasing attrition.

The company will be bring CRJ 200 back out of the desert in the fall to begin growing with the idea of being about 150 airplanes strong.

For those looking at which regional to go too consider Endeavor. Best money in the industry as well as the much needed upgrade to captain is coming.

Originally Posted by Squallrider (Post 1847085)

The thing with bonuses is they can be stopped at anytime. I think people at endeavor (and else where) should ask why a bonus and not a increase to base? Simple answer is a bonus can be stopped a base increase can't.

Originally Posted by vilcas (Post 1846949)

35 CA vacancies, with now downgrades. This is the first pure vacancy notice in a long while. Endeavor has turned the corner new hires are showing up and now you will upgrade time drop like a rock. If you get hired today within 2 years you should have the opportunity.



Reasons for saying this



People leaving for Delta and other majors will continue to create movement.



First officers with CJO's at Delta will soon start moving there as early as next year and some will skip the upgrade now that the money part is there and they will enjoy the quality of life as a senior first officer before moving on to Delta.



The major airlines will start to look more closely at regional first officers again increasing attrition.



The company will be bring CRJ 200 back out of the desert in the fall to begin growing with the idea of being about 150 airplanes strong.



For those looking at which regional to go too consider Endeavor. Best money in the industry as well as the much needed upgrade to captain is coming.

Originally Posted by jetn67 (Post 1847098)

About a year ago they were so arrogant to believe pilots would come work for them just to get a delta interview .With companies like PSA, Compass , and others
growing with quick upgrades they had
no choice but to turn things around or
shut the doors..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by gojo (Post 1847089)

Base increases can be stopped too (hint bankruptcy). However, there is a loa that gaurentees theses bonuses for 4 years. Thank Skywest for the real reason it's off the books as a rate increase due to their brilliant agreement to a scheduled rate reset

Originally Posted by AlaskaBound (Post 1847129)

It's easier to disregard a promise of a bonus than it is to put an airline into bankruptcy. It's also easier to disregard an LOA that says they'll give you a bonus than put the airline into bankruptcy. Cheaper too. So if management was serious they would have offered base wage increases.

It's hardly Skywests fault Delta didn't offer you base wage increases. Your argument is almost comical. It's not always someone else's fault.

Originally Posted by TeddyKGB (Post 1847133)

Glad to see things turning around at 9E. With upgrades starting and by far the best regional FO pay in the industry it seems like a good place to go these days.

Originally Posted by gojo (Post 1847139)

How is it easier. It's a contract now free of loopholes. And my point wasn't about the ease of the task, just that that base wages are not safe either. Look at Eagle/Envoy/PSA for example. Companies seem to always find a formula that works to get what they want. As far as my Skywest comment: I stand by that. Delta isn't stupid, and they're doing this for a reason. If you want to believe it's because the want to take it back later, it really shows a lack of maturity and knowledge of the aviation industry on your part. Btw, thanks for the laugh

Originally Posted by Squallrider (Post 1847085)

The thing with bonuses is they can be stopped at anytime. I think people at endeavor (and else where) should ask why a bonus and not a increase to base? Simple answer is a bonus can be stopped a base increase can't.

Originally Posted by AlaskaBound (Post 1847129)

It's easier to disregard a promise of a bonus than it is to put an airline into bankruptcy. It's also easier to disregard an LOA that says they'll give you a bonus than put the airline into bankruptcy. Cheaper too. So if management was serious they would have offered base wage increases.

It's hardly Skywests fault Delta didn't offer you base wage increases. Your argument is almost comical. It's not always someone else's fault.

Originally Posted by Squallrider (Post 1847085)

The thing with bonuses is they can be stopped at anytime. I think people at endeavor (and else where) should ask why a bonus and not a increase to base? Simple answer is a bonus can be stopped a base increase can't.

Originally Posted by Squallrider (Post 1847085)

The thing with bonuses is they can be stopped at anytime. I think people at endeavor (and else where) should ask why a bonus and not a increase to base? Simple answer is a bonus can be stopped a base increase can't.

Originally Posted by IBPilot (Post 1847169)

You might want to educate yourself on the 20k per year for four years before you come across as totally ignorant.

Originally Posted by Squallrider (Post 1848952)

Worded that wrong, I meant that it can be stopped for new hires at anytime, it's not something that has to continue till next contract negotiation like a increase to base would.

Originally Posted by ShyGuy (Post 1847074)

All those reasons pretty much exist as well for PSA, TSA, Compass, and Piedmont. Why Endeavor?

Originally Posted by VoiceOfReason (Post 1849079)

Not sure they would do that. It seems like their biggest marketing piece. It's likely what is driving their 25+ new hires per class. You don't need fleet growth when you have guaranteed interviews at the rate they do. I saw a piece on one of the 9E social media pages talking about 730 or so pilots moving to Delta by 2018? That seems pretty aggressive. Did anyone else see that? Post it if you did, or I'll try to find it.

Originally Posted by Ray Red (Post 1849282)

I don't have the Bridge Agreement in front of me, and I'm a pilot, so I'm too lazy to look it up but is the hiring commitment tied in with the SSP or is it separate?

In other words, even when the SSP ends does DL have to take X pilot per year from 9E?

Originally Posted by Ray Red (Post 1849282)

I don't have the Bridge Agreement in front of me, and I'm a pilot, so I'm too lazy to look it up but is the hiring commitment tied in with the SSP or is it separate?

In other words, even when the SSP ends does DL have to take X pilot per year from 9E?

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1849288)

The uptake on the hiring commitment is renegotiated when the last SSP eligible pilot interviews. What it's going to be, and the status of the people with CJO's, is unknown. I think the CJO's will be spaced out over the next 5 years, as they want to put 70+ more aircraft here, and need pilots here. Mainline is having no trouble finding pilots. I know pilots won't like to hear that, but management worries about the health of the entire company, otherwise no one would have a job.

Originally Posted by Nantonaku (Post 1849430)

Hopefully that isn't the intent of the exhaustion of the hiring commitment. If so then they could 12 CJO people a year after the last person is interviewed (or take none of the CJO people). Not a very well written agreement if that is the case.

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1849444)

That's what I've been trying to tell people, if the intent was to honor the hiring commitment, it would have been written quite differently in the Bridge Agreement. It would say "the hiring commitment is exhausted after the most junior pilot receives their class date at Delta", it would not say like it does now, the hiring commitment ends with the the last SSP interview.

Originally Posted by Bartok (Post 1849476)

It says it like that so that everyone gets a second chance and the hiring commitment stays in effect until everyone can go through again if not accepted the first time.

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1849509)

Interviews don't end when the last guy goes through, only the hiring commitment ends. They can extend the SSP to anyone, including the new hires. When the last guy interviews, Delta can change the hiring commitment to whatever it wants. I've already been through this with the ALPA attorneys, why do you think Jane flipped out over the FO SSP?