stfoley23

So i've been considering Republic for quite some time now but today a colleague CFI brought to my attention the Envoy cadet program... where you can be brought on as a "company CFI" for one of their partner schools (i'm a current CFI at one) and they'll pay you $1,000 every 100 hours of flight time you get, you get insurance, 401k and travel benefits plus a $17,500 sign on bonus (and obviously the flow thorough to American). I honestly don't know much about Envoy, haven't even considered them before.... but it just seems to me something about it seems too good to be true or there's a catch to it.

moon

The catch is you have to stay for 2 years. They are throwing money around to attract new hires, but with that money they also want some gurantee that you will stick around long enough to make it worth it to them.

stfoley23

Well you aren't moving on to a major in 2 years so that really isnt that big of a deal unless you really hate the job/company right?

Varsity

The $1,000 per 100 hours isn't pay, it's an advance on your bonus. The travel benefits are valued at $5,000 and you will owe it back if you leave in less than 2 years from indoc or IOE (not sure which one).

It's really a pair of golden handcuffs, Non rev benefits in exchange for a contract.

The relative seniority is a concern. There are a ton of people in the program already who will probably get hired before you, slowing down movement down the road.

EDIT: if you're looking for travel benefits as a CFI, look at air Wisconsin. They have a cadet program with no contract that includes non rev travel and actual pay as opposed to an advance.

stfoley23

The travel benefits as a CFI aren't really a big deal to me. More so the time to get to a major airline. I never really was looking into American down the road, have always been interested in Southwest as an end goal, but I would assume this flow through to American with Envoy would get me to a major quicker than just going to a regional and waiting there to get a chance with Southwest

cali2797

Good luck non-reving as a D6 priority.

Varsity

On United?

Ijustlikeflying

My advice for any CFIs reading this forum. DO NOT do a cadet program. There is no need. Flight benifits for 9months until you get your flight time or however long it takes are not worth signing a contract for "any airline." Things are changing so quickly (in a positive direction) that you just might miss out on 80,000 a year first year pay or even a base opening near where you want to live. My advice is to interview at 3 different airlines to get interview experience within 3months of having your flight time.

A few years ago when Endeavor announced 60,000 a year pay, everyone said that would never EVER happen... but it did...
The regional airlines are now competing with eachother for pilots. So wait it out. Your flight benifits will come soon enough...

Good luck once you do begin your interviews. Great time to be an airline pilot.

SilentLurker

Flow is a nice back pocket security plan, but only when AA is hiring, and the wheels are turning. When or if that wheel stops recruiting number at ENY will take big hit. No doubt. Still nice to see light at the end of the tunnel (even if it takes 6-10yrs). Do not sit on your hands or only rely on just the flow to get to mainline. Apply yourself, exceed hiring requirements, stand out a bit, volunteer, and do community service, get a LOR, continue operating safely, and you will find your self at UAL, DL, SW, FDX, UPS, JetBlue, Alaska, before your "flow" timer buzzes to AA in the projected 6-10yrs. In this industry I recommend you make decisions expecting the worse, and hoping for the best.

If I may give you a little perspective... Do quick google research, you will find articles and hiring data which I recently heard and found out AA is behind the hiring curve in 2017 compared to DL & SW. I just heard last week from a CA, & also read how Delta & Southwest have been hiring far more Pilots in 2017 than American Airlines. What makes this problematic is that AA is set to retire much more CA's than any other Mainline. AA is falling behind the hiring power curve and DL /SW is trying to get ahead of it vs waiting until the last minute (remember FAR117 last minute implementation fiasco, they all saw it coming, yet some waiting until the last minute/deadline to implement it and ran into scheduling troubles and flight cancellations and a loss of millions in revenue). Again, AA has much more Pilot retirement than DL, UAL, SW, in the next 7 yrs, yet is drifting further behind DL & SW. Mainline hiring numbers will grow every year, but who will have the capacity and efficiency to train at Mainline? The biggest issue will be various Mainline training departments ability to plan, expand, the training department, sims and sim instructors to handle all the new hires they are expecting, and keep up with training cycles and growth. Looking at training backlog at many WO "regionals"' (ENY for example) and this what we can expect at AA or any major that falls into a training bubble (behind the curve).

Also, UAL & DL are growing Mainline flying, while it seems AA is trying to figure out the opposite and grow scope / increase its WO "regional" flying in efforts to squeeze out better financial numbers.

Give it 1-2 years, and the industry will look totally different. Does not hurt to join pipeline/cadet program. I know people who were in ENY pipeline, but went to other regionals 1yr later once at 1500. You have time. Next year, the industry could be a mess (in a good or bad way ).

Whiskey4

Only a 1-year commitment for CFI benefits. That time runs concurrently with the 2-year commitment for the signing bonus.

Envoy is not looking for people who want to be a Cadet just to get the benefits, before jumping to SkyWest or Air Wisconsin (highest bidder...whatever). Envoy is looking to invest in people who are serious about working for Envoy and/or ending up at AA. If you want to keep your options open and play the field then the Cadet program probably isn't a good fit. It rewards those who are ready to commit.

It's not handcuffs. It's an investment. The payback/commitments serve as a deterrent for those just looking for handouts.