Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 2498633)

The time I called to try and argue my case, I proffered for RAP 1 because it was my last day and I was doing a two leg commute then. Someone junior to me got RAP 1 and I got RAP 2. So not really the same scenario you're describing. The time that I didn't bother to call and argue my case was when I proffered for RAP 2 and they gave me Standby 1 and someone junior to me got RAP 2. In both cases, it appeared to me the other guy had the same schedule constraints as I did so I don't know why they did it. Just pointing out they don't always follow seniority for reserve assignments and it's not always clear why.

Originally Posted by ORDinary (Post 2498646)

Not only is this a contract violation, but this violates an arbitrator's specific ruling that seniority must be honored when awarding RAP preferences, if all else is equal.

Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 2498685)

I didn't know about the arbitrator's ruling. When I read the contract the language seemed a little murky on reserve assignment seniority though (don't have it with me right now). Also, the reason I didn't bother calling in the second instance to argue is that in the first instance, I was basically told "tough" and "we'll consider this call confirmation of your RAP 2". I did not want to risk "confirming" on the second instance given there is a way out of that one.

Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 2498633)

Putting those two sentences together seems to refer to two different cases as though they are one.

The time I called to try and argue my case, I proffered for RAP 1 because it was my last day and I was doing a two leg commute then. Someone junior to me got RAP 1 and I got RAP 2. So not really the same scenario you're describing. The time that I didn't bother to call and argue my case was when I proffered for RAP 2 and they gave me Standby 1 and someone junior to me got RAP 2. In both cases, it appeared to me the other guy had the same schedule constraints as I did so I don't know why they did it. Just pointing out they don't always follow seniority for reserve assignments and it's not always clear why.

I never had a problem getting out of RAP 1 on the first day when I wanted to. When I was two let commuting, there was no way for me to confirm at 5 and not already be on my commute so I never bothered to try to proffer out of it... I was going to be there anyway. But once I was in DFW for the short one leg commute, I successfully proffered out of the RAP 1 on the first day every single time. Just pointing out that it's easy to get out of the default RAP 1. But I understand why long distance commuters hate it so much because you can't take the chance.

Originally Posted by pitchattitude (Post 2498780)

I have not found anything in writing but I was told the language allows them to give you a standby if it is anywhere on your proffer that the order you submit the PREFERENCES on your proffer in is not considered.

Originally Posted by pitchattitude (Post 2498780)

I have not found anything in writing but I was told the language allows them to give you a standby if it is anywhere on your proffer that the order you submit the PREFERENCES on your proffer in is not considered.

Originally Posted by copycopy (Post 2499197)

Not quite right. Standby shifts are contractually considered flight assignments. Flight assignments are considered in order and then Rap proffers. If you proffer for trips, then standby, then rap they will be awarded in that order. If you proffer trips, raps, standbys the standby will go ahead of the rap. Only raps and standbys the standbys will be considered before raps. A standby will not, however, jump up over another flight assignment proffered for.

Originally Posted by copycopy (Post 2499197)

Not quite right. Standby shifts are contractually considered flight assignments. Flight assignments are considered in order and then Rap proffers. If you proffer for trips, then standby, then rap they will be awarded in that order. If you proffer trips, raps, standbys the standby will go ahead of the rap. Only raps and standbys the standbys will be considered before raps. A standby will not, however, jump up over another flight assignment proffered for.

Originally Posted by bigtime209 (Post 2499211)

This is correct. When the next day desk starts working on assignments for the next day after the proffering window closes, the order of assignments is as follows: 1. Flight Assignments 2. Standby Shifts 3. RAPs. They will award each of theses assignments in that order. When someone says "If you proffer for a standby shift, you're automatically gonna get it". That's partially true. If you proffer for only standby shifts and RAPs, then they won't even look at your RAP proffers, they will award you the standby shift since that's the how the order of assignments are done. BUT...if you have an actual trip in your proffers, you will get assigned that first before anything else, assuming the actual trip doesn't go to someone senior.

Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 2499264)

Pilot Contract Q&A 12-2 doesn't exactly say the same you two.

Originally Posted by bigtime209 (Post 2499211)

This is correct. When the next day desk starts working on assignments for the next day after the proffering window closes, the order of assignments is as follows: 1. Flight Assignments 2. Standby Shifts 3. RAPs. They will award each of theses assignments in that order. When someone says "If you proffer for a standby shift, you're automatically gonna get it". That's partially true. If you proffer for only standby shifts and RAPs, then they won't even look at your RAP proffers, they will award you the standby shift since that's the how the order of assignments are done. BUT...if you have an actual trip in your proffers, you will get assigned that first before anything else, assuming the actual trip doesn't go to someone senior.