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Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
-   Envoy Airlines (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/)
-   -   Defeating the stigma (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/131523-defeating-stigma.html)

ClappedOut145 11-13-2020 03:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangolin (Post 3158029)
YV. Out of DFW there’s about 20 Dfw different destinations. I have a pretty good memory about who rides my jump seat.
Which is why I wear funny disguises when I jumpseat. I don’t need the Mesa Stasi keeping a file on me.

CLE to IAH 11-13-2020 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangolin (Post 3158029)
YV. Out of DFW there’s about 20 Dfw different destinations. I have a pretty good memory about who rides my jump seat.

why not just say “Mesa”?

highfarfast 11-13-2020 10:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CLE to IAH (Post 3158346)
why not just say “Mesa”?
It’s too hard to spell out.

NoValueAviator 11-13-2020 10:58 AM
You Mesa guys gotta chill with the jumpseat. You ask nice you get, that's supposed to be the default unless someone decides to start a JS war.

Varsity 11-13-2020 03:52 PM
I'm not a DFW guy, but I never understood why Envoy DFW pilots go so crazy over Mesa. The ORD/LGA/MIA pilots have no idea what the beef is about.

highfarfast 11-13-2020 04:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varsity (Post 3158518)
I'm not a DFW guy, but I never understood why Envoy DFW pilots go so crazy over Mesa. The ORD/LGA/MIA pilots have no idea what the beef is about.
I dont think there s any real beef. They are just a convenient target for the butt of all jokes.

As far as I can tell, the only real beef is with PSA. But that may have changed since they stood their ground this time.

badflaps 11-13-2020 04:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Av8rPHX (Post 3156445)
If you’re checking in as a nonrev,you might as well tell them what aircraft you’re typed in too...”put me in coach,I’m ready to go!”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
I said that once, and never again. I got seat 31B with chairs open in first.....Never, never say coach to an agent.

Urban achiever 11-13-2020 04:50 PM
The only stigma I’ve ever heard of Mesa is that they’re dirt cheap. Anytime you hear an air start cart it’s called the “Mesa mating call”.

as for the crews, they’ve been nothing but excellent in my limited experience.

3400 11-15-2020 08:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 3158525)
I dont think there s any real beef. They are just a convenient target for the butt of all jokes.

As far as I can tell, the only real beef is with PSA. But that may have changed since they stood their ground this time.
I think most of the PSA qualms are behind us.

Cyio 11-16-2020 03:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3400 (Post 3159413)
I think most of the PSA qualms are behind us.
I would tend to agree. The ones that did the naughty back in the day are either gone or overshadowed by all the new hires since then and they stood strong on this last issue, so all good in my book.

Throwitaway 11-16-2020 12:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyio (Post 3159435)
I would tend to agree. The ones that did the naughty back in the day are either gone or overshadowed by all the new hires since then and they stood strong on this last issue, so all good in my book.
https://www.reactiongifs.us/wp-conte...eaking_bad.gif

Av8rPHX 11-16-2020 12:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by badflaps (Post 3158539)
I said that once, and never again. I got seat 31B with chairs open in first.....Never, never say coach to an agent.


Haha. I see what you did there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

say again 11-16-2020 02:07 PM
Ahh, I miss the regionals.... :rolleyes: Grow up!

FangsOut03 11-16-2020 06:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varsity (Post 3158518)
I'm not a DFW guy, but I never understood why Envoy DFW pilots go so crazy over Mesa. The ORD/LGA/MIA pilots have no idea what the beef is about.
Oh man...you put it on a tee....but I’m not going to take a swing

martyByrde 01-19-2021 02:40 PM
I’ve heard there was a pilot fired recently. Any details?

dera 01-19-2021 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyByrde (Post 3183527)
I’ve heard there was a pilot fired recently. Any details?
Where? And how recently?

buddies8 01-19-2021 06:14 PM
And for what

highfarfast 01-19-2021 08:04 PM
[
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyByrde (Post 3183527)
I’ve heard there was a pilot fired recently. Any details?
On my last trip, I was told Envoy fired a bunch of guys for being on RAP out of base. I don't know if that's true but I did move up a bunch of seniority numbers and reserve has been kinda senior lately. Was he one of them?

highfarfast 01-19-2021 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyio (Post 3159435)
I would tend to agree. The ones that did the naughty back in the day are either gone or overshadowed by all the new hires since then and they stood strong on this last issue, so all good in my book.
I agree. We really shouldn't see a lot of PSA bashing for a while here. The furloughs they took for standing their ground was pretty big on this last go. Different group of pilots.

dera 01-19-2021 08:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 3183603)
[

On my last trip, I was told Envoy fired a bunch of guys for being on RAP out of base. I don't know if that's true but I did move up a bunch of seniority numbers and reserve has been kinda senior lately. Was he one of them?
Classic pilot rumors.

No-one got fired for that.

herewego 01-20-2021 04:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dera (Post 3183607)
Classic pilot rumors.

No-one got fired for that.
Maybe not at Envoy, but it has been confirmed by the student council that is has happened at Skywest multiple times, for that exact reason and then lying about it.

havick206 01-20-2021 05:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dera (Post 3183607)
Classic pilot rumors.

No-one got fired for that.
Perhaos not lately, but has happened in the past.

Cyio 01-20-2021 06:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dera (Post 3183607)
Classic pilot rumors.

No-one got fired for that.
Well I know of one for sure that did, however it was more about “why” they were not at their RAP that did them in. Let’s just say telling a major lie on top of missing a rap probably isn’t the best way to handle it.

Either way, tread lightly all.

GHawk 01-20-2021 07:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by herewego (Post 3183647)
Maybe not at Envoy, but it has been confirmed by the student council that is has happened at Skywest multiple times, for that exact reason and then lying about it.
Not surprised at all. Republic has let several pilots go for this and the union can’t help them as the company views it as a “theft of time.” Not a good time to be rolling the dice with your job on the line.

acecrackshot 01-20-2021 07:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by herewego (Post 3183647)
Maybe not at Envoy, but it has been confirmed by the student council that is has happened at Skywest multiple times, for that exact reason and then lying about it.
Ping the IPad and then have all the cause you need.

LAXtoDEN 01-20-2021 08:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by acecrackshot (Post 3183705)
Ping the IPad and then have all the cause you need.
Yeah that’s exactly what happens. They check the reserve board to see 5 guys ahead of them and figure why commute in on the first day of my 4 day reserve block? Suddenly receive a phone call for an assignment on the first day, immediately panic claim they’re sick or whatever.

At that point it doesn’t matter if your company iPad is off, they can track the location. Once they see your location is in another state outside of base, they start building a case. They’ll check when you flew in, if you flew into base.

The company see’s those actions as time stealing because it is. The individuals fired at OO recently playing reserve roulette had an opportunity to come clean and admit there mistakes and they lied again.

pangolin 01-20-2021 08:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN (Post 3183739)
Yeah that’s exactly what happens. They check the reserve board to see 5 guys ahead of them and figure why commute in on the first day of my 4 day reserve block? Suddenly receive a phone call for an assignment on the first day, immediately panic claim they’re sick or whatever.

At that point it doesn’t matter if your company iPad is off, they can track the location. Once they see your location is in another state outside of base, they start building a case. They’ll check when you flew in, if you flew into base.

The company see’s those actions as time stealing because it is. The individuals fired at OO recently playing reserve roulette had an opportunity to come clean and admit there mistakes and they lied again. From everything I’ve hear about any tough situation at SkyWest the minute you lie the chief can’t protect you anymore and you’re done.
Happens at all airlines. Mesa no exception. Happened recently. Yes. Fired.

acecrackshot 01-20-2021 08:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN (Post 3183739)
Yeah that’s exactly what happens. They check the reserve board to see 5 guys ahead of them and figure why commute in on the first day of my 4 day reserve block? Suddenly receive a phone call for an assignment on the first day, immediately panic claim they’re sick or whatever.

At that point it doesn’t matter if your company iPad is off, they can track the location. Once they see your location is in another state outside of base, they start building a case. They’ll check when you flew in, if you flew into base.

The company see’s those actions as time stealing because it is. The individuals fired at OO recently playing reserve roulette had an opportunity to come clean and admit there mistakes and they lied again.
While giving the company a reason to fire you is playing Russian Roulette, OO management has fired plenty of people for far more sketchy reasons (military leave issues and union activities, to name two with which I’m passingly familiar) that gives me NONE of the confidence in their magnanimity that you seem to have.

I don’t work at OO currently so it’s only peripherally my problem. That said, we have access to the same data and come to different conclusions on what OO management thinks reasonable employee treatment is.

LAXtoDEN 01-20-2021 08:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by acecrackshot (Post 3183748)
While giving the company a reason to fire you is playing Russian Roulette, OO management has fired plenty of people for far more sketchy reasons (military leave issues and union activities, to name two with which I’m passingly familiar) that gives me NONE of the confidence in their magnanimity that you seem to have.

I don’t work at OO currently so it’s only peripherally my problem. That said, we have access to the same data and come to different conclusions on what OO management thinks reasonable employee treatment is.
No, they fired those individuals for lies. I’ve heard the story already of the mil leave guy who ruined it for everyone else.

Btw we call it “Reserve Roulette” not Russian, get it right 😁.

rickair7777 01-20-2021 09:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Av8rPHX (Post 3156937)
While we are on the subject...bringing candy/gifts for the crew? I feel like this is a FA/gate agent phenomenon. Commuters would go broke doing this on the regular

(Pre Rona of course)
Gate and FA's appreciate it. I used to do it when jumping offline.

But as flight crew, I'm generally not eating anything provided by a stranger, more likely will give it to the FA's. Besides the obvious security issue, I once had both the FA and FO get sick in flight from nonrev cookies (I'm sure it was just food poisoning)... FA told us later, and the FO started feeling it on the approach, he was full-on praying to the porcelain god by the time he got to the hotel. Another 15 minutes in flight and it would have been awkward, and there would have been paperwork. Fortunately I was trying to lose weight that week.

rickair7777 01-20-2021 09:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GHawk (Post 3183696)
Not surprised at all. Republic has let several pilots go for this and the union can’t help them as the company views it as a “theft of time.” Not a good time to be rolling the dice with your job on the line.
This. Lying about it, as always, is the kiss of death. But many airlines and CP's consider being grossly out of position on reserve the same as lying... if you knew you were out of position, you should have called in and told them before you got called out.

For some reason there's always somebody who thinks they can game that, I've seen FO's fired for that at every airline I've worked for.

pitchattitude 01-20-2021 09:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN (Post 3183739)
Yeah that’s exactly what happens. They check the reserve board to see 5 guys ahead of them and figure why commute in on the first day of my 4 day reserve block? Suddenly receive a phone call for an assignment on the first day, immediately panic claim they’re sick or whatever.

At that point it doesn’t matter if your company iPad is off, they can track the location. Once they see your location is in another state outside of base, they start building a case. They’ll check when you flew in, if you flew into base.

The company see’s those actions as time stealing because it is. The individuals fired at OO recently playing reserve roulette had an opportunity to come clean and admit there mistakes and they lied again.
Please explain how the company, or anyone, can determine the location of a device that is turned off? Last place it WAS, sure, but not where it IS.

Yes, there are near field RFID that can monitor things that don’t have power, but that requires an RFID tag in/on the device and a powered sensor within a few feet.

LAXtoDEN 01-20-2021 09:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3183764)
This. Lying about it, as always, is the kiss of death. But many airlines and CP's consider being grossly out of position on reserve the same as lying... if you knew you were out of position, you should have called in and told them before you got called out.

For some reason there's always somebody who thinks they can game that, I've seen FO's fired for that at every airline I've worked for.
I recently heard the individual fired from OO for time theft was a CA.

It’s like being pulled over for a DUI, most likely that wasn’t your first time driving a car drunk, you just got caught this time.

nonononononono 01-20-2021 09:34 AM
"Last place it WAS, sure, but not where it IS"

has snowden taught you nothing? the government has had dvd's since the 70's man. the future is not distrubuted evenly

captive apple 01-20-2021 09:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by acecrackshot (Post 3183748)
sketchy reasons (military leave issues and union activities, to name two with which I’m passingly familiar)
Well then you know that guy was on the organizing committee because he knew he was on a crash course with termination.

pitchattitude 01-20-2021 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonononononono (Post 3183777)
"Last place it WAS, sure, but not where it IS"

has snowden taught you nothing? the government has had dvd's since the 70's man. the future is not distrubuted evenly
I don’t rely on Snowden or anyone else. I have more than a bit of inside information on ACTIVELY tracking specific devices and I wouldn’t have if it was as easy as pinging a device that was turned off.

So I want to know what this person THINKS they know.

Not that I’m condoning not being where you are supposed to be, I just don’t believe anyone who says the company can tell where your Ipad is if it’s off.

acecrackshot 01-20-2021 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN (Post 3183772)
I recently heard the individual fired from OO for time theft was a CA.

It’s like being pulled over for a DUI, most likely that wasn’t your first time driving a car drunk, you just got caught this time.
Well, I do love it when post modernist situational ethics demonstrate themselves.

CLE to IAH 01-20-2021 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pitchattitude (Post 3183882)
I don’t rely on Snowden or anyone else. I have more than a bit of inside information on ACTIVELY tracking specific devices and I wouldn’t have if it was as easy as pinging a device that was turned off.

So I want to know what this person THINKS they know.

Not that I’m condoning not being where you are supposed to be, I just don’t believe anyone who says the company can tell where your Ipad is if it’s off.

ol’ blue falcon can get in that iPad.

Steal yo trips

ClappedOut145 01-20-2021 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by acecrackshot (Post 3183705)
Ping the IPad and then have all the cause you need.
Letter 16-03 number 3 has the guidance on this. The company cannot ping the iPad during the normal course of business. It would be a good fight to have.

herewego 01-20-2021 02:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pitchattitude (Post 3183882)
I don’t rely on Snowden or anyone else. I have more than a bit of inside information on ACTIVELY tracking specific devices and I wouldn’t have if it was as easy as pinging a device that was turned off.

So I want to know what this person THINKS they know.

Not that I’m condoning not being where you are supposed to be, I just don’t believe anyone who says the company can tell where your Ipad is if it’s off.
Wait I'm confused.
Are you saying that Chem trails really are mind control chemicals added to our fuel?
Obama really was born in Kenya?
Trump won by a landslide?
and a Miata really is a sports car?

Or are you saying all those things are false?


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