PilotCrusader

It's always fun to watch the bottom feeding MESA trolls get in on threads like this. MESA may or may not have a DFW crew base some day, but they WILL always be bottom feeders. If you want to go work for a company that hires imbeciles over the phone, then MESA is the place for you. If you want to go to work for a company that says its classes are full for the year, yet I know two individuals who have been hired over the phone and sent to class within two weeks, so yeah go to work for Mesa! The airline that lies before you even get in the door. If you want to go work for by far the lowest pay, per diem , and benefits out there, yup, MESA is it! Don't get blinded by "current" fast upgrade times as a measure of when you would actually upgrade. Recruiters these days are as unscrupulous as used car salesmen; they sold their soul to the devil a long time ago and have no conscience about what actually happens to you.

deltajuliet

Didn't realize you were Envoy, Jvw. Good luck on the talks. Everybody I know had incredible respect for your group's decision to turn down a bad contract.

JetPilotMan

Be realistic, plan for the worst, be happy when things are better -

- Envoy is going through some serious changes. Anyone who says we are not contracting (for whatever reason) is wrong. In the last 18 months we've lost roughly 1200 pilots (and the majority have not been due to flows). We were told last year that they'd hire 600. Reality was that only between 150-200 were hired AND finished training. So, right now opportunities for a new hire are shrinking.

- Many, if not all, regionals are in a "stuck mode". Many have very senior groups and many have had little or no growth (and many have had serious contraction). That creates frustration. You may see a lot of it on these boards. Take some of it with a grain of salt. Similarly, the industry is a rumor mill. I once started a rumor in ATL while headed to ONT only to see if it would beat me there. "It hasn't happened until it's happened"...that cuts both ways! Until I see an aircraft actually sitting on the ramp, anything management, union reps, or pilots say is rumor. Similarly, until I see a layoff notice, Envoy still exists. Rumors abound and change daily.

- Growth - not just fleet replacement - is the path to happiness. Happiness from moving off reserve, happiness from upgrade, happiness from higher pay, happiness from hours logged as PIC and the chance at starting again at a major (where happiness may be greater because you may make significantly more doing the exact same job).

- Crew scheduling everywhere can be hard. Commuting can be hard. Try your best to live in domicile. Your life will be more "your own" when sitting reserve (if not airport standby). If you can't, one leg to domicile. Realize you will lose parts of days off or whole days off commuting. Realize that while on probation, there may be times you CAN'T get home commuting. Even off probation, remember commuting means you are not "off work" until after the commute. Also realize that living outside of domicile will cost more (apartment, crash pad, whatever).

- To some degree, go where they will hire you. That today is probably everywhere ... but I know guys who have waited for their dream and seniority is passing them by...

- Try to remember to be happy and that you love what you do. I think most if not everyone on here can say that when the door is closed they really love their job. The other stuff (low pay, schedules, not being home) can eat away at you if you let it. If you're young...life might be easier and the industry is in transition and, barring something terrible, you will have opportunities wherever you go!

Good Luck!!!

Jvw700

Understandably we are all pretty skeptical of any good news whatsoever... So we'll see what happens...

snippercr

I dunno. Even if they include everything we want and no 12/4 for current employees but if it includes a B scale I hope our union walks

Ar Pilot

RSV in DFW and ORD is currently around the 3 year mark. I have a friend in JfK who seems to be on the bubble of a line and RSV. He's been here for 1.5 years.

Bzzt

We're going with this rumor again? "Big announcement Friday" you heard it here first.

RyanP

Its an "official" rumor now.

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Contract Update
We have been informed that we should know this week if the company and union will be able to begin the formal process of crafting a pathway forward for Envoy and AAG. In the meantime, with each passing day the dynamics of the regional industry change that much more in our favor.

In NY, we will have either a Meet-N-Greet like the other bases; or we'll have an alternate type of unity event which will draw support from others in the industry. This should also provide an opportunity for media coverage of an event that will be favorable to our cause.

Just over a year ago the company felt the need to demand additional concessions to match Delta feed costs. Based upon publicly available data we were able to determine the cost variance between Envoy and Delta's regional airline - Endeavor - was only about $3 per hour in total pilot related costs. In spite of the relatively minor cost differences, AAG used that opportunity to demand massive concessions during a period of record breaking profits. Since then, the industry has gone through another period of dynamic change. Recently AAG leaders stated that the FFD industry has changed yet again. I congratulate AAG and their leadership team for recognizing the rapidly evolving changes in the FFD marketplace. I now challenge them to react accordingly and make Envoy the leading AA feed provider and pilot recruitment center.

They know how to do that; it's very simple. Give us the planes, and create a more definitive path from college classrooms to AA classrooms. Increase FO compensation, protect senior CA's who wish to retire, and give the rest of us a certain level of job security while we await being hired at a legacy or flowing to AA. We have a strong pilot group ready willing and able to help AAG make Envoy the leading regional airline in the world. That will take investment on their part in providing us the tools to do the job more efficiently (new airplanes); and commitment on their part to ensuring our pilots are provided a clear unobstructed pathway to a mainline career, while protecting those who wish to finish their career here.

The truth is that for most of us, they could not raise the compensation enough to keep people here when national and legacies are offering jobs. They can, however, make it attractive enough that the few pilots that are entering the Part 121 world and/or are coming up through the system won't even consider working anywhere other then Envoy.

In closing, it can not be cheaper to send the flying back to AA mainline instead of giving us a decent contract; yet that is precisely what our parent company (and all major brands) are now doing. In this new FFD industry; the question is no longer who can do the flying the cheapest; it's who can do the flying at all. That comes with a price tag. The first management team to realize this and act accordingly, wins. And we all want to be winners!

Fraternally,

NY LEC121 Chairman





Air Line Pilots Association, International
Air Line Pilots Association, International

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Bzzt

The NY guys are on the ball with news, I appreciate that. I have my doubts that the company will do the math and decide to place aircraft and flow at envoy, hope I'm wrong.

JetPilotMan

I have a friend on reserve in NY hired early 2013 who is on the bubble between reserve and a composite or relief line. Has held it once (!@#@!#) and been really close several months (probably says more !@#@!#) and is watching shrinking number of lines in NY. He also naturally lives there so, life is "better".