Photon

like calling an afss? if it's a local flight then checking ADDS online should be enough by far

250 or point 65

So where is your documentation that you looked up ADDS? When you call a wx briefer, you give them your name or tail number, theres a paper trail that says you got weather. ADDS is nice, and you may in fact gather more information from there than a FAA online or phone wx brief, but its not going to save your certificate. To me, a 5 minute phone call is worth all the time and money i spent on my certificates.

Photon

I use weather briefings for cross countries, as do all students, but for local flights, no one at our school uses a weather briefing, not instructor, not the student.
You only need to become familiar with the information, checking the weather like radar, tafs, metars, area forecast, should be enough for a local flight by far
you can print the weather if it makes you feel better

Pilotpip

How will you prove that to the Feds? Adds, while a great resource, is useless for this. Take a minute or two to log on to DUAT so you have a record of recieving a briefing.

All it takes is one student bending metal or a new POI with a desire to flex his autority a bit for that non-chalant attitude about something as simple as a weather briefing to come back and bite you.

CYA.

USMCFLYR

Agreed - this is what our SOP calls for when flying local flights and then local flights are also defined. If going outside the "local flying area" then we have to use the Navy Flight Weather Briefing service (or FSS).

USMCFLYR

Photon

That's where I feel the difference lies though.
If weather was a factor in an accident, and this was a local flight, then you are either negligent or stupid.
If weather was a factor in a cross country flight, then there is a bit more leeway, as a cross country can be 10+ hours.
Forecasting 10 hours in advance, in your exact route of flight, over many states if applicable is a bit shady, so it's nice to get a comprehensive weather briefing in that respect.
However, on a local flight, your time in the air, and your checking the weather right before lift-off, should give you a concise option of a go / no-go situation.
If I was a FAA guy, and I saw someone fly intentionally into known bad weather, on a local flight, then there is really only two options. He checked the weather, and he went anyway, i.e he is reckless/stupid, or he didn't check the weather, and he was negligent.
That's why I feel like the two scenarios fall into different categories, and the reason why I don't get a weather briefing for every local flight I do.
And that's just the way it's being practiced at our school

250 or point 65

I don't think "nobody else at the flight school does it" is going to fly with a Fed.

That is unsafe thinking. Wouldn't you be mad if your CFI taught you something wrong and you busted a checkride, then he says "well that how everyone at the school teaches it"?

Pilotpip

Here again, you're missing my point. How do you have any proof that you checked ADDS?

Furthermore, you're making a very bad assumption based on if you were a "FAA guy". You're not. I promise you that when something bad happens, you better have your ducks in a row because they will come after you for every small thing they can find wrong. How are you going to prove that you checked the weather? How are you going to prove you did a weight and balance computation? How are you going to prove that you determined that your aircraft had adequate performance to operate within the regulations? ADDS and "That's the way it always is/That's the way my school does it" won't cut it.

Your complacency is beyond dangerous. Where do you draw the line? How do you tell your student that something is not important for 70% of their training time, but important for those cross countries? Who do you think the feds come after when your student makes a mistake? You're already going to spend a considerable amount of time preflighting, and doing all the other stuff for that local flight. What's another 10 minutes?

Photon

Indeed how?
How can you prove that you did the weight and balance, how can you prove that you haven't had a drink for 8 hours, how can you prove that you had the shoulder harness fastened when landing, how can you prove that you were flying with the correct altimeter setting, how can you prove that you were flying 2000 feet from that cloud, how can you prove that you did the takeoff and landing distance before takeoff.
HOW can you prove that you did not just sit down and do all of this AFTER the accident. Unless you crashed into the local FSDO it's not like they're going to be there within 5 minutes, and you have NO records saying you did any of this before take-off, it's just stuff you have with you, the weather briefing seems to be the only thing you're giving special priority here, and the FAR only states that you should get the latest weather reports and forecasts, not how.
I'm not sure if you're misunderstanding me, I'm not saying people shouldn't check the weather or do all the preflight that is requried for a local flight, I'm just saying that checking all the resources on ADDS is enough by a long shot, without calling a weather briefer. After you've checked the METARs, TAFs, checked the Radar, and all other pertinent information online, you have a clear picture of how the weather is going to be like for that flight.

250 or point 65

Only some of these things are stuff that they can't prove. However, WX is a very very easy one to bust you on. There is plenty of evidence that you got a wx breifing either online or by phone. Once they check that, they will move on to the next thing.

EVEN WORSE! What happens when your student goes out on a solo and bends some metal? When the feds ask him about his training, he stresses the lack of importance you placed on an official wx briefing. You'll quickly know what the numbers 7 0 9 mean.