Where should I learn to Fly??? DCA???
#1
New Hire
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Position: Piper Warrior II
Posts: 3
Where should I learn to Fly??? DCA???
Greetings,
I am currently pursuing a career in Airline aviation. I would like to preface that I am new to the airline industry and not very knowledgable concerning current issues, which schools to look into, etc. I am in the process of obtaining my private pilot lisence at a small flight school. I want to pursue professional training (Multi-engine, instrument, ATP, MEI, etc.) from a larger, more respected flight school or program. Here is where I need help.
I have looked into Delta Connection Academy and have heard mixed reviews about it. For someone new to the industry, it looks promising with a year as a CFI and a job interview lined up afterwards. I am completing my Masters degree this semester so it would be pointless to go back and get an aviation degree.
I am however curious if any/all of you experienced pilots could give me a little direction as to where I should look for professional training? Also, could you give me your own take on DCA and if it is worth pursuing. I GREATLY appreciate any and all feedback. Please point me in the right direction.
Thank you all,
I am currently pursuing a career in Airline aviation. I would like to preface that I am new to the airline industry and not very knowledgable concerning current issues, which schools to look into, etc. I am in the process of obtaining my private pilot lisence at a small flight school. I want to pursue professional training (Multi-engine, instrument, ATP, MEI, etc.) from a larger, more respected flight school or program. Here is where I need help.
I have looked into Delta Connection Academy and have heard mixed reviews about it. For someone new to the industry, it looks promising with a year as a CFI and a job interview lined up afterwards. I am completing my Masters degree this semester so it would be pointless to go back and get an aviation degree.
I am however curious if any/all of you experienced pilots could give me a little direction as to where I should look for professional training? Also, could you give me your own take on DCA and if it is worth pursuing. I GREATLY appreciate any and all feedback. Please point me in the right direction.
Thank you all,
#3
1. "Delta" connection academy is no longer owned by DAL, and either already has or will soon lose all affiliation with DAL. Also I'm not sure that any of their affiliate airlines are even hiring right now.
2. The "Glossy Brochure" flight academies tend to charge waaaay to much for what you get. In general I would avoid them all unless you have a very good reason otherwise (like VA benefits).
3. The most economical scheme for flight training is usually to find a smaller part 61 school near your home. Keep your job, live at home, and train part to get all of your ratings. Once you have the instructor ratings you can teach part time (keep the day job) until the industry is ready to accept you. Otherwise you risk being an entry-level pilot in a bad economy (also known as a "McDonalds Crewperson")
4. Do you have a 4-year college degree? If not, do not even consider an aviation career until you have a plan to get one.
5. Have you done any flying? if not, go get a PPL at your local airport. Then fly around, enjoy aviation, and talk to other pilots. Maybe get an instrument rating. Only then should you consider an aviation career.
2. The "Glossy Brochure" flight academies tend to charge waaaay to much for what you get. In general I would avoid them all unless you have a very good reason otherwise (like VA benefits).
3. The most economical scheme for flight training is usually to find a smaller part 61 school near your home. Keep your job, live at home, and train part to get all of your ratings. Once you have the instructor ratings you can teach part time (keep the day job) until the industry is ready to accept you. Otherwise you risk being an entry-level pilot in a bad economy (also known as a "McDonalds Crewperson")
4. Do you have a 4-year college degree? If not, do not even consider an aviation career until you have a plan to get one.
5. Have you done any flying? if not, go get a PPL at your local airport. Then fly around, enjoy aviation, and talk to other pilots. Maybe get an instrument rating. Only then should you consider an aviation career.
#4
Unfortunately Rick that's not what they want to hear.. These guys want the schools with uniforms, big promises, and you hit the nail on the head-Glossy brochures.
It really amazes me what their training priorities really are. I'm going on my 3rd year as an Instructor, at a 141 school with no uniforms and 2000 plus hour instructors, and I just don't see the level of enthusiasm in theses kids that I had when I was training years ago.
Sorry to get off task, but those thing really bother me for this industry. To answer the original post, You probably will end up going to DCA no matter what these experienced guy/gals on this forum say to you because it's not what you want to hear! It should be about quality training with experienced instructors while continuing to be employed. Oh, I'm sure they would let you wear a uniform if you asked!!
It really amazes me what their training priorities really are. I'm going on my 3rd year as an Instructor, at a 141 school with no uniforms and 2000 plus hour instructors, and I just don't see the level of enthusiasm in theses kids that I had when I was training years ago.
Sorry to get off task, but those thing really bother me for this industry. To answer the original post, You probably will end up going to DCA no matter what these experienced guy/gals on this forum say to you because it's not what you want to hear! It should be about quality training with experienced instructors while continuing to be employed. Oh, I'm sure they would let you wear a uniform if you asked!!
#5
Well, the original poster Mr. Hughey came here because he wanted to hear what professional pilots had to say about Delta Connection Academy, and hopefully he will listen to the answer. Perhaps it would be useful to point out however that in certain turns of the road it is arguably worthwhile to purchase a high-cost education from a large pilot academy like Delta Connection, AllATPs, or similar. It so happens those conditions do not exist right now and probably will not for years to come. Since he asked I would say there are several factors you need going it if you are considering a large flight academy, such as
1) money is generally not an issue for the student, and he or she is able and willing to spend a lot more money in order to get to an airline job faster
2) loans are readily available at reasonable interest rates, if money is an issue
3) regional airlines are hiring at healthy rates and have been for a while
4) the airlines business is generally in good shape, pilots are flowing through to the majors, the backlog of furloughs is low, and the US economy as a whole is in good shape
5) there is no 1500-hour minimum requirement in order to be hired at an airline
6) the school itself is managed properly, and there is little doubt about its longterm viability
These are just a few of the things I would want to be present before I would shell out the extra cash to a large flight academy for training rather than slog it out cert by cert at Part 61 flight school gathering certificates as my discretionary income allowed. An FAA certificate is an FAA certificate no matter where it is obtained, and the airlines regard all flight tickets the same.
1) money is generally not an issue for the student, and he or she is able and willing to spend a lot more money in order to get to an airline job faster
2) loans are readily available at reasonable interest rates, if money is an issue
3) regional airlines are hiring at healthy rates and have been for a while
4) the airlines business is generally in good shape, pilots are flowing through to the majors, the backlog of furloughs is low, and the US economy as a whole is in good shape
5) there is no 1500-hour minimum requirement in order to be hired at an airline
6) the school itself is managed properly, and there is little doubt about its longterm viability
These are just a few of the things I would want to be present before I would shell out the extra cash to a large flight academy for training rather than slog it out cert by cert at Part 61 flight school gathering certificates as my discretionary income allowed. An FAA certificate is an FAA certificate no matter where it is obtained, and the airlines regard all flight tickets the same.
#6
Well, the original poster Mr. Hughey came here because he wanted to hear what professional pilots had to say about Delta Connection Academy, and hopefully he will listen to the answer. Perhaps it would be useful to point out however that in certain turns of the road it is arguably worthwhile to purchase a high-cost education from a large pilot academy like Delta Connection, AllATPs, or similar. It so happens those conditions do not exist right now and probably will not for years to come. Since he asked I would say there are several factors you need going it if you are considering a large flight academy, such as
1) money is generally not an issue for the student, and he or she is able and willing to spend a lot more money in order to get to an airline job faster
2) loans are readily available at reasonable interest rates, if money is an issue
3) regional airlines are hiring at healthy rates and have been for a while
4) the airlines business is generally in good shape, pilots are flowing through to the majors, the backlog of furloughs is low, and the US economy as a whole is in good shape
5) there is no 1500-hour minimum requirement in order to be hired at an airline
6) the school itself is managed properly, and there is little doubt about its longterm viability
These are just a few of the things I would want to be present before I would shell out the extra cash to a large flight academy for training rather than slog it out cert by cert at Part 61 flight school gathering certificates as my discretionary income allowed. An FAA certificate is an FAA certificate no matter where it is obtained, and the airlines regard all flight tickets the same.
1) money is generally not an issue for the student, and he or she is able and willing to spend a lot more money in order to get to an airline job faster
2) loans are readily available at reasonable interest rates, if money is an issue
3) regional airlines are hiring at healthy rates and have been for a while
4) the airlines business is generally in good shape, pilots are flowing through to the majors, the backlog of furloughs is low, and the US economy as a whole is in good shape
5) there is no 1500-hour minimum requirement in order to be hired at an airline
6) the school itself is managed properly, and there is little doubt about its longterm viability
These are just a few of the things I would want to be present before I would shell out the extra cash to a large flight academy for training rather than slog it out cert by cert at Part 61 flight school gathering certificates as my discretionary income allowed. An FAA certificate is an FAA certificate no matter where it is obtained, and the airlines regard all flight tickets the same.
I definitely think that it will be the experience gained AFTER (or during the time you are getting your ratings) that is going to set a pilot apart from the masses - not including that one or two heaven-send contacts that you might make along the way!
I think in the end Cub is right in the long term sense; maybe there was a time and place for a big initial outlay of cash and short training time to gt started on that road to the airlines where seniority meant everything, but times are different in the business right now and ideas have to change along with them. Slow and steady seems to be the more practical endeavor right now. I mean every point of Cub's post above tracks back to something in the industry that isn't quite in line with his requirements right now. Not one of two items in a long list - but every one of them I'm sure that other guys could come up with even more.
USMCFLYR
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: The Far Side
Posts: 968
If there's any chance of employment in your (originally) chosen field, then go that route and pursue aviation on the side. Use the experience gained in both fields to determine your direction - while making money.
Originally Posted by ABerry23
It should be about quality training with experienced instructors while continuing to be employed.
#8
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2009
Position: E-175 FO
Posts: 72
Guys, 'college graduates' aren't exactly in better straits at the moment than wanna-be airline pilots-- you do know that, right?
I'm getting kinda tired of the old refrain 'Get a degree in something else, not aviation!' ... Aviation isn't alone in not caring what sort of degree (if any) you hold. That BS in psychology or english literature isn't going to lead you into a career any more surely than a degree in airline operations or some other such thing.
Frankly, college is a racket. I don't have a degree and I make a healthy salary at 30 that I doubt I could make if I spent twenty years flying for the airlines. That doesn't necessarily mean that I'm happy doing what I do, just that I happen to possess a skill and it happens to be valuable. People with degrees in my field invariably are useless-- I look for personality, attitude and aptitude, not paper, when I interview.
Again, college is truly a racket. College is big business. Like all big business, it wants to make money. Thus the business of education makes it seem like the only way to excel is to go to college, and if you tell someone something enough times, it'll eventually stick, even if only a little bit... Does this sound familiar? It should; the glossy-brochure companies use the exact same tactic, because they're in the exact same business.
(Of course, that said, I hope that someday, when and if I pursue a job as a pilot, my experience excelling in a highly technical career field will count for much more than a lousy degree from some community college. All jobs in my industry require a degree "or equivalent experience", which I possess in droves. Unfortunately, in a market situation where the need is low and the pool of applicants large, and the need for "superstars" is nonexistent, paperwork and proficiency are all that matter...so I'm likely doomed. Fortunately, CFI or 135 is the peak of my ambition. (Actually, flying warbirds and classics is the peak of my ambition, but I digress...))
~Foxy
I'm getting kinda tired of the old refrain 'Get a degree in something else, not aviation!' ... Aviation isn't alone in not caring what sort of degree (if any) you hold. That BS in psychology or english literature isn't going to lead you into a career any more surely than a degree in airline operations or some other such thing.
Frankly, college is a racket. I don't have a degree and I make a healthy salary at 30 that I doubt I could make if I spent twenty years flying for the airlines. That doesn't necessarily mean that I'm happy doing what I do, just that I happen to possess a skill and it happens to be valuable. People with degrees in my field invariably are useless-- I look for personality, attitude and aptitude, not paper, when I interview.
Again, college is truly a racket. College is big business. Like all big business, it wants to make money. Thus the business of education makes it seem like the only way to excel is to go to college, and if you tell someone something enough times, it'll eventually stick, even if only a little bit... Does this sound familiar? It should; the glossy-brochure companies use the exact same tactic, because they're in the exact same business.
(Of course, that said, I hope that someday, when and if I pursue a job as a pilot, my experience excelling in a highly technical career field will count for much more than a lousy degree from some community college. All jobs in my industry require a degree "or equivalent experience", which I possess in droves. Unfortunately, in a market situation where the need is low and the pool of applicants large, and the need for "superstars" is nonexistent, paperwork and proficiency are all that matter...so I'm likely doomed. Fortunately, CFI or 135 is the peak of my ambition. (Actually, flying warbirds and classics is the peak of my ambition, but I digress...))
~Foxy
#9
The problem with networking at a puppy mill is that the only people you meet are slightly more experienced C-172 pilots. Universities are little better, although you get hook up with some older alumni.
I think you would be better off at a thriving GA field with a variety of pilots and aircraft (especially if you are interested in corporate flying).
I think you would be better off at a thriving GA field with a variety of pilots and aircraft (especially if you are interested in corporate flying).
#10
The problem with networking at a puppy mill is that the only people you meet are slightly more experienced C-172 pilots. Universities are little better, although you get hook up with some older alumni.
I think you would be better off at a thriving GA field with a variety of pilots and aircraft (especially if you are interested in corporate flying).
I think you would be better off at a thriving GA field with a variety of pilots and aircraft (especially if you are interested in corporate flying).
USMCFLYR
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