Originally Posted by AirportKid

Ya I thought that sounded pretty darn fast... about how long do you think it might take roughly?

Originally Posted by TonyWilliams

I'd guess that if you've never flown a twin, you'll need 10-20 hours to make it all happen smoothly for the examiner.

Originally Posted by AirportKid

Okay guys, hopefully this will sound a bit better to you guys...

As I mentioned earlier, I took a tour of Indian Hills, which is a pretty nice community college in my area. The main thing that attracted me here was that they have a pretty darn good aviation program. So I went up there to visit and really enjoyed myself. I got a really good opportunity to meet the instructors and chief pilots, see the aircraft, get familiar with the program and timeline, and even got to shoot an approach in their brand new full motion simulator!

Overall it was a very good experience, and its a very small program (less than 25 students) which I think will allow for alot of one on one time and some quality instruction. The price is also pretty competitive as well... it costs roughly $40K for my Private thru CFII... This price also includes my Associates of Science in Aviation.

After graduating the Indian Hills program I plan on attending my hometown 4 year university that my mom works at, which means I get 75% off tuition, allowing me to get my bachelors degree for under $6K, which is a pretty darn good deal if you ask me. This will allow me to have a minor in Aviation, and a major in something else, which is the best of both worlds in my opinion.

HOWEVER, there are a couple drawbacks to the two year aviation program... While it is substantially cheaper than ATP (By about $15,000...) I will NOT get my multi rating, Commercial Instructor certificate, or my MEI. Their reasoning about not including this in the program, is apparently, they have a connection with a local "friend of the program" who runs an airport that I can get my multi rating at... They said this would take about a weekend, because I will obviously have all my other ratings, and apparently a multi rating is pretty easy and quick to get, its just expensive...

While in working on my bachelors degree I can instruct to build some time and make a little money on the side, while working at my current job part time...

After I graduate however, not sure how that will work, but thats a ways down the road...

So here is a break down of this plan...

PROS:
Done in two years
Quite a bit cheaper (taking into account the lack of a multi rating)
Live a regular college life
GIRLS (see above)
Get a minor in aviation, a major in Business... BIG +

CONS:
No multi, CFMEI, or commercial instructor rating (not sure of the abbreviation for that lol)

So let me know what you guys think.... Thx again!

Originally Posted by gdpballin

Go to college first, get your partying done, then get your ratings.

Originally Posted by KiloRomeo1

Does anyone have any input on which is better: CC pilot training which does not include some courses

Originally Posted by Phantom Flyer

Hello Airport Kid:

While I commend you for planning you life out ahead of time I really have to ask "what's the hurry ?". You seem hell bent on getting your certificates and ratings as fast as humanly possible thinking that's going to get you into the majors four years after high school. Perhaps you need to either speed your planning up so that you have a seat at one of the majors within the next two to three years or more importantly, stop and do some "realistic " planning.

1) Any obvious problems with your plan ? Yes, it's completely unrealistic !

2) Getting hired at a regional after six months of "CFI'ing" ? Not a chance.

3) I've known people who flew for a regional carrier and went to school and they said it was difficult managing both. The regional carriers are a job and while it's certainly possible to work and attend school, it a "tough row to hoe". Do you think you're Chief Pilot is going to drop a trip for you so that you can attend a lecture or a required lab ?

4) I think you'll have difficulty getting hired at a regional airline with practically no experience and no four year degree, even if one isn't required.

5) My overall thoughts: you seem to feel as though you have to get your certificates and ratings as fast as possible and you'll be "entitled" to a job at a regional and then naturally, a major carrier right after that. While I hate to discourage you, it doesn't work that way and your naive if you think it does. It's a tough route to get into the right seat at a major and most pilots have a four year degree, a lot of flight time in multi and/or turbo jet aircraft and have paid a price to build time.

Please don't misunderstand me. I hope that you can realize your dreams but I think your future would be better served if you stop and do some realistic planning.

G'Luck Mate

Originally Posted by TonyWilliams

This part is a bit skewed. You will not complete your multi in a weekend. Guaranteed.

Originally Posted by bcrosier

When I did mine (almost 25 years ago, so take that for what it's worth) that was the one part of the program Purdue did under Part 141. As I recall, it was 9 hours of instruction plus one for the check ride, so Tony's estimate sounds about right.

I'm also confused about the "Commercial Instructor Certificate." Not sure what that is - I've been out of the CFI business for quite a while now, but I thought the basic flavors of CFI were:
CFI-A Airplane
CFI-I Instrument Instructor, and
CFI-ME Multi-engine
It's certainly possible something has changed along the way since I went down that road, but from what I'm reading the only things I see you needing are the ME rating and ME Instructor if you wanted to add that.

I think you guys are right and for whatever reason I was just getting confused, and that there is not actually a "CFI for a Commercial Ticket."But then that begs the question, what kind of CFI do you need to be in order to teach Comm students?

I do think your revised plan is a lot better, particularly since you'll be able to gain experience instructing during the two years you're working on your BS degree. Thank you! I feel that it is all around siginificantly better and I will get the best of both worlds of being able to live a normal college life but all the while getting my ratings relatively quickly.

Originally Posted by mswmsw

Originally Posted by KiloRomeo1

First I would like to thank eveyone on here for your input to a life changing decion of mine.

Secondly I would like thank this computer for making me rewrite this entire thread again.

I am a 21 yr old CC student that has always dreamed of becoming a pilot. My plan has always consisted of finishing my B.S. in Marketing, then entering the fast track program at the local ATP here in Phoenix, AZ. While falling onto their site the other day I noticed that they now offer degrees with there flight program, I thought to my self "what a great way to nock out 2 birds with 1 stone". Since then I have been planning and "scheming" on which would be the best way of going about this. Seeing that I am a FULLY independet student (with the help of the federal goverment), my decision are very finacially based.

AirportKid- You had mentioned earlier about Indian Hill CC in Iowa and of all places my family owns a house outside of Ottumwa. I could live for free and because Indian hills is a CC if would be fesable for me to acquire the nessisary federal grants and loans to help me pay.

My new plan is to possibly head to Indian Hill in fall 2011 or spring 2012. If you are still planning on heading out that way, let me know, I would be great to have a like-goaled friend, expecially in such a boaring place.

Agreed man, I will pm you later!

Does anyone have any input on which is better: CC pilot training which does not include some courses and dose not include a guarenteed job and is the middle of no where and would force me to quite me nice bartending job in Scottsdale or ATP which would be roughly over twice as exspensive for me but would include all nessicary courses and include a job for 6 months and I could still work at my job. (btw if I would to pick the ATP route would still go through there university program to include my flight hours for a dregree.)

I am ready for a change and a jumpstart on my carrer, thank you everyone for you valued words.

Originally Posted by bcrosier

What courses are not included? If it's a case of MEL/MEI not being included, I don't think that's a big deal (assuming there is a way to add them).

KiloRomeo: I too am confused about what course exactly you thought were not included. I am under the impression that the only two ratings you would not recieve are the Multi and MEI. While doing my campus visit or what have you, they made it clear that they have a very detailed and somewhat rigorous ground school program. I do not mind this at all, and even better yet is that they are all available online. I think this would be great, and I would only have to show up to campus on training days.

And when I get all my ratings except for the Multi and MEI for $40K, with tuition included, thats a good $15k cheaper than ATP, and a good $25K cheaper than University of Central Missouri's four year flight school and probably $125,000 and kidney cheaper than Riddle or North Dakota :P

Coursework-wise, I think you should look closely at what the ground school courses at each place cover. I'm presuming each one will cover the basic topics for Private/Instrument/Commercial and CFI. Take a look at what they offer in the way of courses geared toward Transport category systems and operations, advanced meteorology, aerodynamics, and so on. My personal thought is there are a lot of ways/places to do the flight portion, but the knowledge you gain in ground courses really makes a difference early in your career.

All of these were included in the ground school overview that I recieved.



The bold part is huge. Less debt or more cash in your pocket when you leave school is a tremendous asset. The value of the guaranteed job for six months is debatable, but it is something. That said I don't think its value offsets the additional costs you're going to incur.

Originally Posted by AirportKid