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Old 04-25-2014 | 03:04 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by RunForTheMoney
I agree and admit the prospect of being turned down by regionals is probably my greatest hesitation at this point. It kills me because I honestly just do not want to be a flight instructor. Knowing I could build all my ATP flight time in well under a year is attractive without a doubt, but I guess the question I am getting at is:

If I went the C-152 rental route, would I have a decent shot of getting picked up by a regional airliner in the current state of pilot hiring?
Why dont you want to be a flight instructor? The amount of studying you have to do will prepare you for the 121 environment. Not to mention, you will meet more people flight instructing and a 135 oppurtunity may pop up to build that multi time. Dont pay for the hours, not worth it....
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Old 04-25-2014 | 08:26 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by RunForTheMoney
I have recently been quoted on 1000 hours of C-152 rental for approx $25 an hour (dry time) and possibly less after some negotiation. I plan to fly 30-40 hours a week until I have satisfied the rental agreement. I live in north central Florida, so afternoon thunderstorms will be the main deterrence for flights. Otherwise, I plan to quit my current (non aviation) job and pursue this full time. I also will not have to relocate. So far this is a solo venture, so I would like to have a safety/co pilot on board as well.

My questions are:
-Is this a wise idea?
-Any suggestions/recommendations?
-Am I a fool and wasting my money?
-What would you do?
I am probably the least qualified person to offer career advice, however, since you asked for opinions, I will share my opinion & maybe my views will help you to make a better, more informed decision.

My opinion may be contrary to the popular school of thought.

Your Plan:

$25 per hour dry is a good rate if you can secure a plane.
Find a safety pilot to share the expenses & duties, it will cut your costs in half.

30 to 40 hrs per week every week are a little on the high side, having 2 days of 10 fight hours with a couple of days 3-4 hrs mid week is doable. 25 hrs per week to about 100 hrs per month is more of a normal sustainable average which will work out for long term without burning out yourself.

Your questions:

Is this a wise idea?

It Depends... It totally depends on your personal, family & financial situation, how old you are, how are you situated in life etc. etc.... ????

If you are in your 20's, single, basically free to move around, then it will be better to take the CFI route. If you don't want to be a CFI, then time build to 500 TT & then fly Aerial Mapping / Jump pilot / 135 cargo route to ATP mins.

So, for a younger person this route will NOT make sense, financially or otherwise. Taking one of the traditional routes will save you a lot of money & make you a better, well rounded pilot.

BUT.....

If you are in your mid / late 30's or 40's & you have the family commitments to take care; If you are well set in your professional life & if you have a job/profession/business which pays really well; Taking a big pay cut to become a CFI will NOT be a feasible option for you and you have the funds to do this, then this self sponsored time building route to ATP mins WILL make more FINANCIAL sense.

Am I a fool and wasting my money?

The answer is NO depending upon as mentioned above

What would you do?

I personally have been in both the categories mentioned above.

I started flying 24 yrs ago, when I was 16, took very long to finish my Commercial & then I became a flight instructor, have about 300 hrs of dual given & also used to fly PA-31 for a corporate.

Then I took a 12 yr exile & When I started planning my comeback about 3 yrs ago in 2011, I became the 2nd category, late 30's with family commitments etc etc.

So, I built almost 750 hrs on my own dime, sharing the flying, doing the safety pilot with 2 other partners, whom I met here at this forums, who were also in the similar age/ professional category as me.

For me, it was much riskier to become a CFI again, I'd have to quit my main profession & income would stop, I'd risk everything I had achieved. So, it was cheaper & safer for me to build 750 hrs on my own dime.

If I went the C-152 rental route, would I have a decent shot of getting picked up by a regional airliner in the current state of pilot hiring?
I have a job offer & a class date from a regional. I have interviewed with Skywest & also had / have interview offers from Air Wisconsin, Express jet, PSA & Legacy American Eagle (Envoy).

I have gone to job fairs & told everyone that I don't have a flying job & how I built the hours. No one said anything about my time building...

The 2 flying partners that I flew with & shared flying time & expenses:
1st guy had multiple job offers & is already flying the line with Express Jet. He was never became a CFI, went from Pvt to Commercial to ATP mins on his own dime. 2nd Guy is finishing up his ATP mins, should be done next month, he also has multiple job offers in his pocket & confirmed interviews from all the companies that matter.

Bottom Line: If you have ATP mins with a clean personal record & no check ride failures, then regionals don't care how you got there....


I personally know 4 other people who built time on their own & are all now in the either working at various regionals or are in training right now. I also know 5 more people building time same way & taking the same route.

But they are all in the 2nd Category I mentioned above.....

Best of luck in whatever you choose to do.

If you have questions, feel free to ask me.

Last edited by bcpilot; 04-25-2014 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 08:47 AM
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Can you get hired by the regionals doing this? Yes. Is it a good idea? Hell no. What are you going to learn flying a 152 for 1200 hours? Nothing. The first couple thousand hours are where light bulbs go off, mistakes are made, aha moments come about, and skills are refined. Want my advice? You don't have to CFI but get a job and build your hours doing something productive.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 09:29 AM
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Solid advice from both sides of the spectrum here. I have some other career opportunities in motion right now as well, so there is a possibility I may not end up going this route at all. If I do come back to this I am leaning towards the rental route though. The prospect of splitting costs with a safety pilot is also very attractive. I am still open minded to going CFI (feel free to message me if anyone is interested). There is just something extremely unapealing to me about doing CFI as a necessary step to the airlines. Of course there is part 135 too, but I would likely/definately have to do some time building and obtain my multi commercial/instrument to make myself more attractive for hire. I really appreciate the insight from everyone one here. Cheers.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 09:36 AM
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Not sure I can edit the last post, but feel free to message me if anyone is interested in splitting the cost of a C-152 time builder.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by RunForTheMoney
Not sure I can edit the last post, but feel free to message me if anyone is interested in splitting the cost of a C-152 time builder.
You will need to get your post count up before you can send & receive private messages.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 12:16 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by RunForTheMoney
Hello,



My questions are:
-Is this a wise idea?
-Any suggestions/recommendations?
-Am I a fool and wasting my money?
-What would you do?

I look forward to any advice or insight you guys have to share.

I can tell from you responses you are pretty set on doing this.

You have received great advice from Cub and others. This is NOT a wise idea. It is a waste of money. No I would not do it.

your skill set would be so limited as to be mind numbing. PIC of a 152 with another safety pilot on board? Where would you ever learn the real ability to perform when it counted? All the check rides, weather, operational pressures, and different types of aircraft build up a base that you bring to the cockpit. Your base would be very very narrow. Can you imagine two of you in a cockpit of a airliner when things go wrong?

Go out get your CFI and CFII, get a tailwheel endorsement, fly some aerobatics. Look for a VFR 135 job as soon as possible.
Learn you craft. lives depend on it.
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Old 04-26-2014 | 04:54 PM
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Flying 30-40 hours a week till you fulfill the requirement?
You are at 250 now and need 1500 which means you'll need to fly 1250 hours.
I don't remember reading if you were the going to be the only guy flying this aircraft, if your not, multiply the below times by two at a minimum..
It sounds like you are the "sole-operator" of a single C-150, if you could fly 40 hours a week, that's over 31 weeks of flying at 40 hours a week.
I can tell you from experience, while it is very possible to fly 40 hours a week, but weather, maintenance, (scheduled or unscheduled) happen which makes flying 40 hours a week an unlikely event.
The aircraft will need oil changes, parts repair replacement, possibly and engine overhaul if your putting 1250 hours on it, depending on how many hours the engine has now, tire changes, etc...also, you will want some kind of insurance to cover you for an accident.

Also, are you going to fly the same routes around home, or are you truly going cross country? where will you stay? hotels and eating out all the time is expensive and adds to the cost. I read somewhere in here that the dry rate plus fuel adds up to over 50 grand!...

All of these items I promise will stretch your 40 hours per week to a more conservative average of about 20-25 hours per week. (you'll want a day off eventually, try flying 6 to 7 hours a day in a C150, it hurts! ask an instructor how it feels!)

Planes break, people get sick, parts take time to ship, owners sell off their planes, planes get damaged in storm, ...
The 31 weeks will probably be closer to 50 weeks at 25 hours per week (1250/25=50)
I hope if you chose this route that you have some form of contract with the owner and they are in it for the long haul?

IF you have 50K (if you have 10K?) sitting around somewhere go back to flight school and get your CFII-MEI and GET PAID TO FLY THOSE 1250 HOURS! (not yelling, just emphasizing) OR if you have 50K, go out and buy a used C150. They can be had for 12K-15K with reasonable times left on the engines. Find one with descent time left on the engine, fly it to TBO then sell it for 8 or 9 thousand and recoup some of the cost?

Last edited by doublerjay; 04-26-2014 at 05:02 PM. Reason: add stuff
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Old 04-26-2014 | 07:23 PM
  #19  
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Easy answer, tie it to a tree with an automated gas pump, come back 999.5 hours later, fly a lap in the pattern and call it a day, you had the intention of flying the entire time. You just couldnt get it untied right
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Old 04-27-2014 | 07:12 PM
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To the OP, Great input from Cub and others. Among other things, you apparently have no idea what it's like to spend 40 Hrs a week in a 150... You will get pretty good at flying one though. I do commend you for soliciting advice.
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