METO Guido

Yet clearly includes…"other purposes." Article 17 bis speaks to "social effects" of the agreement in addition to protecting labour standards, rights & principles. One of those social effects, it could be argued, gaining unfair competitive opportunity though taxable income sheltering as do US tech giants now calling Ireland home.

Doesn't matter, this thing never flies.

Grumble

NAI is doing nothing but putting downward pressure on pay and work rules... get out from under Bjorn's desk.

Typhoonpilot

But wait, Avianca 787 Captains makes less money than Norwegian's do. Pretty much all South and Central American airlines pay much less than Norwegian and have for decades. Why is this not an ALPA call to action?

Sniper66

Avianca 787 captain pay is 14 k per month and that's indeed low for 787 pay , just as it is low the Emirates Captain pay that you bragged about all these years.
So
Don't just shoot **** out of your mouth, I have friends there at Bogota and I know exactly what they make and they know themselves how low their pay is too.

ALPA did not send you to Dubai, your Messed up Usair management did, so stop bashing our union and our fight against foreign Airlines that are after our jobs.

NEDude

So it is your assertion that U.S. airlines and pilots have an inherent right to all international flying? How is Emirates after "your jobs"? How is Norwegian after "your jobs". How is Eurowings, which pays its widebody captains $7,650 per month, after "your jobs"? How are any of them after "your jobs" any more than the pilots at Spirit are after the jobs of the pilots at Delta, or the pilots at Southwest are after the jobs of the pilots at United?

NEDude

No it is not. First of all it has put upward pressure on pay and work rules in Europe. I have witnessed that effect first hand.

Secondly, the argument that a European airline could put downward pressure on work rules is silly and demonstrates total ignorance over European laws, which guarantee employees far greater rights than any US employee could hope for. Did you know pilots in Europe are guaranteed, by law, to get a minimum of four weeks of vacation annually? How long does it take to earn that at Delta? Did you know that most European airlines do not have a reserve system, where a US pilot can spend years on reserve? Are you aware that all European pilots are guaranteed to receive paid maternity leave and most get paid paternity leave? Are you aware that most pilots are required, by law, to have a pension plan funded by their company? For example the pilots at Norwegian's new CDG crew base are getting a 20% company contribution into their government guaranteed pension plan because it is required by law. Are you aware that most European airlines, including Norwegian, have a variety of work plans available, such as full time, 75% or 50%? I know several pilots who work month on, month off, and use their month off to do contract work, or instruction, or go into half retirement and live off their pension for their off month.

The work rules in Europe are FAR better than anything you get in the United States, even with the LCCs.

METO Guido

Bjorn? NAI to ORD right under Council 12's nose. Nordic billionaire, comedian.

Spin

NEDude,
Tell all that to ryanair contract pilots

Typhoonpilot

I flew at Avianca on the 787. I know exactly what the 25 year seniority Avianca captains and the 3 year seniority F.O.s make in salary

First hand knowledge trumps "friends". Nice try though

NEDude

NAI will not be serving ORD. NAS will be doing that route. Even if the so-called "flag of convenience" legislation is passed, and ALPA gets everything it wants, you will still see Norwegian 787s in ORD. There is absolutely nothing about NAS that ALPA can oppose.