Air France 447
06-02-2009, 12:12 PM
#141
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: 747 captain
Posts: 1,549
CNN international just reported that the Brazilian air force found two debris fields with recognizable signs of aircraft components (a seat, some life preservers) but no signs of survivors
God Bless
God Bless
06-02-2009, 12:14 PM
#142
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 737 Capt
Posts: 1,166
Originally Posted by elfarto
This is my First Post on this forum..so you will excuse my techical incompetence 
, as i'm more of an afficionado..
I've been some reseach and found some striking similarities between the sequence of events reported by ACARS and the following Emergency Airworthness Directive from 01/15/09:
15 January 2009 - The EASA issues Emergency Airworthiness Directive No 2009-0012-E to address the above A330 and A340 Northrop-Grumman ADIRU problem of incorrectly responding to a defective inertial reference.
EASA Airworthiness Directives Publishing Tool
IF you look at the pdf inside that URL you will see that:
"An A330 aircraft experienced a sudden nose down order while in cruise. This
order was preceded by an automatic autopilot disconnection and triggering of the
“NAV IR1 FAULT” Electronic Centralised Aircraft Monitor (ECAM) Caution. "
There is also a procedure to recover from such cases of failure
- NAV - IR 1 2 (2 3) (1 3) FAULT
Note: Flight controls are in alternate law. Refer to F/CTL %u2013 ALTN LAW
(chapter 4 of the AFM)
Turn off the affected IRs.
Turn off the corresponding ADRs.
Set the affected IR mode rotary selectors to OFF.
Use AIR DATA switching as appropriate.
Use ATT HDG switching as appropriate.
Do not use speed brakes
-If CG above 32%:
Manually perform a forward fuel transfer from the trim tank.
Note: If trim tank pump is not available, do not perform manual forward fuel
transfer while speed is at or below 270 kt or while in climb.
Which seems to be a very similar scenario to the one at the moment of the accident.
Big Question:
Had the pilots been trained in that procedure.
BTW: I came across that EAD looking on wikipedia's ADIRU page:
Air Data Inertial Reference Unit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
, as i'm more of an afficionado..I've been some reseach and found some striking similarities between the sequence of events reported by ACARS and the following Emergency Airworthness Directive from 01/15/09:
15 January 2009 - The EASA issues Emergency Airworthiness Directive No 2009-0012-E to address the above A330 and A340 Northrop-Grumman ADIRU problem of incorrectly responding to a defective inertial reference.
EASA Airworthiness Directives Publishing Tool
IF you look at the pdf inside that URL you will see that:
"An A330 aircraft experienced a sudden nose down order while in cruise. This
order was preceded by an automatic autopilot disconnection and triggering of the
“NAV IR1 FAULT” Electronic Centralised Aircraft Monitor (ECAM) Caution. "
There is also a procedure to recover from such cases of failure
- NAV - IR 1 2 (2 3) (1 3) FAULT
Note: Flight controls are in alternate law. Refer to F/CTL %u2013 ALTN LAW
(chapter 4 of the AFM)
Turn off the affected IRs.
Turn off the corresponding ADRs.
Set the affected IR mode rotary selectors to OFF.
Use AIR DATA switching as appropriate.
Use ATT HDG switching as appropriate.
Do not use speed brakes
-If CG above 32%:
Manually perform a forward fuel transfer from the trim tank.
Note: If trim tank pump is not available, do not perform manual forward fuel
transfer while speed is at or below 270 kt or while in climb.
Which seems to be a very similar scenario to the one at the moment of the accident.
Big Question:
Had the pilots been trained in that procedure.
BTW: I came across that EAD looking on wikipedia's ADIRU page:
Air Data Inertial Reference Unit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
06-02-2009, 12:18 PM
#144
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Legacy FO
Posts: 4,096
I'd rather have them troll here for information than airliners.net or some other forum.
What's real stupid is, why would someone come here and ask if the crew was training in this procedure? How would anyone here know? Perhaps an AF crew member could say if the company has implemented training, but that doesn't mean they were trained.
What's real stupid is, why would someone come here and ask if the crew was training in this procedure? How would anyone here know? Perhaps an AF crew member could say if the company has implemented training, but that doesn't mean they were trained.
06-02-2009, 12:23 PM
#145
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: right for a long, long time
Posts: 2,642
Originally Posted by elfarto
This is my First Post on this forum..so you will excuse my techical incompetence , as i'm more of an afficionado..
I've been some reseach and found some striking similarities between the sequence of events reported by ACARS and the following Emergency Airworthness Directive from 01/15/09:
, as i'm more of an afficionado..I've been some reseach and found some striking similarities between the sequence of events reported by ACARS and the following Emergency Airworthness Directive from 01/15/09:
Originally Posted by 11fan
Did someone just elfarto?
06-02-2009, 12:25 PM
#146
Working Class Dog
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: Spares Pusher
Posts: 1,668
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
...why would someone come here and ask if the crew was training in this procedure?
06-02-2009, 12:28 PM
#147
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 361
06-02-2009, 12:29 PM
#148
New Hire
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Posts: 3
Originally Posted by shiznit
You apparently have some spelling incompetence too!!
Glad you make fun out of my nick..!
And btw, i'm not trying to troll anything, i came across that piece of info and i wanted to share it.
Thanks!
06-02-2009, 12:35 PM
#149
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: B767
Posts: 1,901
Originally Posted by chuckyt1
There have been a number of accidents that have occurred while "whoop whoop pull up" was sounding. Two that I can come up with, off the top of my head, that were CFIT.
06-02-2009, 01:37 PM
#150
seeing the large hubs...
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 73N A
Posts: 3,706
Originally Posted by Zoot Suit
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