"The Event" Has Occured at Avantair
12-15-2010, 11:47 AM
#31
On Reserve
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Posts: 22
Originally Posted by nfnsquared
I'm a bit confused. Can you elaborate? There is nothing in the Terms of Service that says posting of a company's internal communications is prohibited.
You can post in the spirit of free communication, but if its true and they don't like it, they'll call you in for an intimidation session. "ie" How did you vote on the 14/14, or you know you have training coming up.
Good Stuff!
12-15-2010, 01:20 PM
#32
New Hire
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by GlasssPilot
You've been "using/lurking and appreciating APC for several years now"?
How is that possible? You have two posts and a join date of this month.
Know what I think? I think you are another poster who, for some reason, likes to set up multiple accounts and have threaded conversations with himself.
Why would someone do that? They would have to be really passionate about the topic they are posting about...say have a primal emotion triggered like love or hate.
Maybe even darker like revenge. You would have to feel so slighted by actions years gone by that it is worth the effort and aggravation to go out and set up accounts so you can post two and three sides of the conversation.
And what is the goal of all of this? The utter destruction of those that dare let you go AFTER you quit and THEN called in sick? The one who made you fly with an oil pressure needle almost in the yellow? Who wouldn't upgrade you? You are obviously such a stable person... holding a grudge 2 fricken plus years later and posting to anyone who will listen on every forum you can. You would make a fine Captain I'm sure. Being crazy shouldn't be a problem...(sarcasm off)
There will be no utter destruction. Losers on forums don't bring down publicaly traded companies.
Too sad. Truly pathetic.
How is that possible? You have two posts and a join date of this month.
Know what I think? I think you are another poster who, for some reason, likes to set up multiple accounts and have threaded conversations with himself.
Why would someone do that? They would have to be really passionate about the topic they are posting about...say have a primal emotion triggered like love or hate.
Maybe even darker like revenge. You would have to feel so slighted by actions years gone by that it is worth the effort and aggravation to go out and set up accounts so you can post two and three sides of the conversation.
And what is the goal of all of this? The utter destruction of those that dare let you go AFTER you quit and THEN called in sick? The one who made you fly with an oil pressure needle almost in the yellow? Who wouldn't upgrade you? You are obviously such a stable person... holding a grudge 2 fricken plus years later and posting to anyone who will listen on every forum you can. You would make a fine Captain I'm sure. Being crazy shouldn't be a problem...(sarcasm off)
There will be no utter destruction. Losers on forums don't bring down publicaly traded companies.
Too sad. Truly pathetic.
Glass, you need counseling. Seriously. I assure you I am not the person in question. Regardless, what a classic personal attack! Did you learn that method of communication from politicians? Don't like the message or train of thought? Go for the jugular. I agree, it was entertaining though.....
12-15-2010, 05:36 PM
#33
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 158
OK Kyle, since we're on a first name basis now...
“I didn’t know we were on a first name basis. I shortened “deb” from your username. I have no ideal who you really are, or if you for some bizarre reason used your real name here. I simply followed the rules and used a part of your username. I’m sure that since you used MY real name, you received an infraction from Vagabond or USMCFlyer and they deleted it. They wouldn’t want anyone to accuse them of having 2 sets of rules.”
Exactly how did I attack you, and why would an Avantair pilot have to tell you that I did a 180?
“ That’s an easy one. You attacked me by lying about me and made the false accusation that I want Avantair to fail. I have said in MANY, MANY posts that I want Avantair and ALL aviation companies to succeed. I think you are an educated and intelligent woman. Now, use that intelligence and education and actually READ what I said. NO apology needed on that one. I will let it go. I have done more to help these pilots than you can ever imagine. Hurt them? Hardly. When you and your children get your 7-7 back, you can thank me for helping. You simply don’t know what you don’t know.”
You could simply read my post back to you after I cooled off. I simply asked you to not twist my words, which you even admitted to and apologized for.
“Yes, I did. Grammar isn’t my strong suite. However, I have never lost control of an airplane in SLC, nor have I busted the ADIZ in D.C. Perhaps I am a better pilot than I am a speaker.”
But the next paragraph after that, you were kind of sarcastic in the way you referred to my "hubby". Then, you say that I seem articulate and caring.
“Hubby is a term of endearment at my house. My wife doesn’t subscribe to the feminist doctrine, so things like “Hubby” don’t offend her. If it is offensive to you, accept my apologies. No sarcasm was intended.”
Well, thanks, but why are you attacking me again? Are you sincere? I was just going to leave this alone, but I feel that you deserve some answers. So I'll answer some of your questions if you will courteously answer mine. Don't worry, I don't plan on attacking you:
“You will have to show me where I attacked you. Be specific so I can address it. I simply pointed out that an Avantair pilot contacted me and said that you did a complete 180 in your post. I then read your new post and agree 100% with that person. You did a complete 180. I have your original post. You originally said that you were concerned over the past few months about your husband at work. You said that you were worried when he called you at 6:00 am on duty and again at 8:00 pm, still on duty, and you didn’t like how the new schedule affected your children and your family (paraphrased). You deleted that post and made a new one with a completely different take on how things were. You even spent some time referencing ME and my experience at Avantiar, instead of staying on topic and talking about the union vote that is coming up. How pathetic. Did you do a complete 180? Absolutely!”
1) Do you want to know the true reason that I deleted my post? The honest answer is that my husband was worried, but not about Avantair. He was worried that what might happen, did happen: He was afraid that you would take my frustrations and twist them for your agenda against Avantair. And he was right, that happened!
“Whatever. No one believes that. If your husband has nothing better to do than to worry about what lil ole me will say…….Gee, am I the Master of the Internet? For God’s sake, tell him to stand up and be counted!”
So yes, those twisted words which were not true certainly couldn't have helped him. You admitted to this and apologized. Thank you, I accepted your apology and I thought that it would end there.
“Twisted? No. Mixed your words with other posters words? Yes.”
Unfortunately from your above post, it seems that it didn't end there, and you still choose to pursue me and mock me. I do not think that is a gentlemanly thing to do.. I think that is "sad". Just sayin. Not an attack.
“Trust me, no one is pursuing you. You chose to step in here with the boys. Welcome. If you are woman enough to attack the conditions at Avantair on a public forum, then be prepared for the consequences. Personally, I am proud of you. I hope your “husband” (not hubby) tells you he is proud of you too for speaking out against the current situation at Avantair. This country has too many mice and not enough men. Be counted!”
2) I feel that you were unnecessarily sarcastic about my "change of heart" post. I explained that, although I vented, everything about the company is not negative just because the hours are long and the schedule has been imposed on them. So after my "hubby" and I talked about good and bad, I listed some not all of the wonderful things that Avantair did for us. And not just us. Avantair flew a pilot's wife to see him when he went to the hospital on a tour. They sent a Captain home first class when his Dad passed. They parked a plane when a co-pilot's wife delivered early. Does this seem like a totally evil place to you? Me either. Avantair could be his dream job. You can love your company and still have frustrations with it. But it seems that you didn't want to hear that and only want negative. Sorry, I can't help you there with only negativity. Not an attack.
“Excellent points. Your first post was all negative about Avantair and you deleted that one. Your second post was all positive about Avantair and you kept that one. You certainly mixed it up. It is too bad you felt the need to delete half of your truths. You didn’t have a “change of heart” about anything. You still feel the same way about Avantair today that you did 6 days ago. You simply deleted the bad stuff and replaced it with the good stuff. Sorry….but lots of people see that as suspicious.”
3) Loving your company and having a union do not have to be contradictory, if you look at South West.. My husband will vote as he wants to vote. So I will be brave and admit again that we come from a union family. His experience is mixed... Very poor with Teamster 747, very good with ALPA. Like I said, it is his choice. Not an attack.
“I have never “loved” a company so that is weird to me. ANY company will send you packing when they are done with you. I know your “husband” will be voting to get his 7-7 back. He “gets” this. Good for him”
Alright Kyle, I have tried to answer some of your questions honestly. Will you you kindly do do the same for me? Here they are... Not attacks.
1) Kyle, we don't hold any grudges against you... Why would you keep attacking me, my husband, my family.
“Never happened. Lets agree to disagree on that one.”
I know that you are angry at Avantair, but where does it end.
“Angry? Hardly. Entertainment? Priceless! Where does it end? It ends when your kids get their dad back. But they could pay me my money for the sick days I earned but wasn’t allowed to use. That was illegal.”
Our children are part of the Avantair family. Are they, too, valid targets?
“I would have to say Yes, they are valid targets since the company you now love so much just took their father away from them for another month each year. Now they get to see dad 5 months per year instead of 6 months per year. But hey, we need to keep the stockholders happy, not the kids…..right?”
Do you have a Girlfriend, a Wife, Children?
“Wife. She calls me “hubby” sometimes.”
How would you feel if someone was doing this to them? Again, not an attack. Just a question.
“Easy answer. I hold her accountable for her actions. If she decides to play with the boys, she needs to expect to get treated like the boys. She doesn’t carry a victim mentality.”
2) Do you have anything at all positive to say about Avantair in your posts?
“The very first words out of my mouth about this company were good words. Again, use that intellect and education that I know you have and actually READ it. http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/fractional/39708-review-avantair.html
This one……I could use an apology on since you didn’t even bother to read anything:”
Can you at least admit that there are a lot of great people there?
“Nearly everyone I met there seemed to be great people. I would list their names but Vagabond wouldn’t like that. Only YOU get to use people’s names. J”
Do you think all managers there are evil, even after I told you told you some of our personal true stories. Do you think I made them up? I gave you negative and positive, but do you not care about the positive too? Not an attack, valid question.
“No, they arern’t all evil. But, about 90% of the pilots I flew with didn’t like the D.O. No one I speak with today likes the fact that the CEO negotiated himself a compensation package of nearly $1,000,000 this year while your kids were forced to do without dad even MORE. Do the Christmas presents and stuff like that make up for it? You decide. Lets your kids decide. Those are personal choices.”
3) What is your goal here? Do you wish for the ultimate destruction of Avantair, even if it means every pilot, your former friends and coworkers, will be on the street?
“My goal? I don’t have one. This is simply dialogue. I need all companies to succeed and have great contracts for their pilots. That is why UPS757 posted to you (to everyone) that the best thing your husband can do is to vote yes on unionizing the pilot group at Avantair. It helps the industry as a whole. Your second question doesn’t deserve an answer.”
You may have a valid gripe against this company, but where does this end? Not an attack, valid question only.
“You asked this above and I answered it above.”
4) If Avantair was like you say, and my Husband was now in jeopardy because of me, wouldn't you be at least partially responsible for his demise by twisting my words.
“No, you did all of the damage with your first post, then apparently posted your family name too. The D.O. told me personally that he reads these forums every day and he has friends who are moderators. YOU are 100% responsible if they retaliate. Either way, I am still proud of you for standing up and being counted.”
Would you not be hurting a fellow pilot and his family? Why would you do that? What would it accomplish in your fight against Avantair? Again, I'm not yelling, just asking. Not an attack.
“I am insignificant on Avantair’s radar scope. You give me WAAAAAY too much credit.”
5) We don't dispute that they might owe you some money, but why go after your friends. Badmouthing the company can't be helping your friends there? Does it? Not an attack.
”Name one friend that I have gone after? Then I can address your question.”
6) Are you trying to somehow help the Avantair pilots?
“No offense, but again, you don’t know what you don’t know.”
My husband says that your information is often incorrect and misleading..
“Then have him grow some and challenge me. Tell him to stand up and be counted! Does he ever tell you that my information is often right on the money and he is too scared for his job to give me credit here? I will patiently wait for your answer on that question.”
Not always. And that you use your alter ego trxline to keep posts active between your other username.
“He doesn’t appear to be as smart as you are. I have only one username.”
They get it, you are angry at the company, but where does it end. Do the ends justify the means?
“For the 3rd time, I already answered this question.”
Can you look yourself proudly knowing you attacked a pilot and his family?
“What pilot and his family did I attack? That’s a pretty dramatic statement, wouldn’t you say?
Is that really worth compromising just to get back at Avantair? I can tell you that if you are trying to help them, that your efforts are not respected and appreciated by the way you have gone about this. Wouldn't you rather regain their respect? Again, not attacks.
“I get plenty of appreciation from current pilots at Avantair. They feed me tons of information. They know that they will be fired if they speak for themselves. Just because your husband isn’t one of them doesn’t matter to me. Hell, he thinks I am trxline. He isn’t trustworthy. I don’t want his support until he wises up.”
Kyle, I would ask if you will answer those questions and then, I would really like to know if you will be willing to let this end here.
“I did answer your questions as requested. Let what end? I support the union just like you did in your original post. If you don’t like what you read here, don’t participate. Now that you have turned this union thread into a thread about me……..LOLOLOLOL Nice deflection!”
Thank you in advance,
“My pleasure.”
Debb
“BeenThereDoneIt”
“I didn’t know we were on a first name basis. I shortened “deb” from your username. I have no ideal who you really are, or if you for some bizarre reason used your real name here. I simply followed the rules and used a part of your username. I’m sure that since you used MY real name, you received an infraction from Vagabond or USMCFlyer and they deleted it. They wouldn’t want anyone to accuse them of having 2 sets of rules.”
Exactly how did I attack you, and why would an Avantair pilot have to tell you that I did a 180?
“ That’s an easy one. You attacked me by lying about me and made the false accusation that I want Avantair to fail. I have said in MANY, MANY posts that I want Avantair and ALL aviation companies to succeed. I think you are an educated and intelligent woman. Now, use that intelligence and education and actually READ what I said. NO apology needed on that one. I will let it go. I have done more to help these pilots than you can ever imagine. Hurt them? Hardly. When you and your children get your 7-7 back, you can thank me for helping. You simply don’t know what you don’t know.”
You could simply read my post back to you after I cooled off. I simply asked you to not twist my words, which you even admitted to and apologized for.
“Yes, I did. Grammar isn’t my strong suite. However, I have never lost control of an airplane in SLC, nor have I busted the ADIZ in D.C. Perhaps I am a better pilot than I am a speaker.”
But the next paragraph after that, you were kind of sarcastic in the way you referred to my "hubby". Then, you say that I seem articulate and caring.
“Hubby is a term of endearment at my house. My wife doesn’t subscribe to the feminist doctrine, so things like “Hubby” don’t offend her. If it is offensive to you, accept my apologies. No sarcasm was intended.”
Well, thanks, but why are you attacking me again? Are you sincere? I was just going to leave this alone, but I feel that you deserve some answers. So I'll answer some of your questions if you will courteously answer mine. Don't worry, I don't plan on attacking you:
“You will have to show me where I attacked you. Be specific so I can address it. I simply pointed out that an Avantair pilot contacted me and said that you did a complete 180 in your post. I then read your new post and agree 100% with that person. You did a complete 180. I have your original post. You originally said that you were concerned over the past few months about your husband at work. You said that you were worried when he called you at 6:00 am on duty and again at 8:00 pm, still on duty, and you didn’t like how the new schedule affected your children and your family (paraphrased). You deleted that post and made a new one with a completely different take on how things were. You even spent some time referencing ME and my experience at Avantiar, instead of staying on topic and talking about the union vote that is coming up. How pathetic. Did you do a complete 180? Absolutely!”
1) Do you want to know the true reason that I deleted my post? The honest answer is that my husband was worried, but not about Avantair. He was worried that what might happen, did happen: He was afraid that you would take my frustrations and twist them for your agenda against Avantair. And he was right, that happened!
“Whatever. No one believes that. If your husband has nothing better to do than to worry about what lil ole me will say…….Gee, am I the Master of the Internet? For God’s sake, tell him to stand up and be counted!”
So yes, those twisted words which were not true certainly couldn't have helped him. You admitted to this and apologized. Thank you, I accepted your apology and I thought that it would end there.
“Twisted? No. Mixed your words with other posters words? Yes.”
Unfortunately from your above post, it seems that it didn't end there, and you still choose to pursue me and mock me. I do not think that is a gentlemanly thing to do.. I think that is "sad". Just sayin. Not an attack.
“Trust me, no one is pursuing you. You chose to step in here with the boys. Welcome. If you are woman enough to attack the conditions at Avantair on a public forum, then be prepared for the consequences. Personally, I am proud of you. I hope your “husband” (not hubby) tells you he is proud of you too for speaking out against the current situation at Avantair. This country has too many mice and not enough men. Be counted!”
2) I feel that you were unnecessarily sarcastic about my "change of heart" post. I explained that, although I vented, everything about the company is not negative just because the hours are long and the schedule has been imposed on them. So after my "hubby" and I talked about good and bad, I listed some not all of the wonderful things that Avantair did for us. And not just us. Avantair flew a pilot's wife to see him when he went to the hospital on a tour. They sent a Captain home first class when his Dad passed. They parked a plane when a co-pilot's wife delivered early. Does this seem like a totally evil place to you? Me either. Avantair could be his dream job. You can love your company and still have frustrations with it. But it seems that you didn't want to hear that and only want negative. Sorry, I can't help you there with only negativity. Not an attack.
“Excellent points. Your first post was all negative about Avantair and you deleted that one. Your second post was all positive about Avantair and you kept that one. You certainly mixed it up. It is too bad you felt the need to delete half of your truths. You didn’t have a “change of heart” about anything. You still feel the same way about Avantair today that you did 6 days ago. You simply deleted the bad stuff and replaced it with the good stuff. Sorry….but lots of people see that as suspicious.”
3) Loving your company and having a union do not have to be contradictory, if you look at South West.. My husband will vote as he wants to vote. So I will be brave and admit again that we come from a union family. His experience is mixed... Very poor with Teamster 747, very good with ALPA. Like I said, it is his choice. Not an attack.
“I have never “loved” a company so that is weird to me. ANY company will send you packing when they are done with you. I know your “husband” will be voting to get his 7-7 back. He “gets” this. Good for him”
Alright Kyle, I have tried to answer some of your questions honestly. Will you you kindly do do the same for me? Here they are... Not attacks.
1) Kyle, we don't hold any grudges against you... Why would you keep attacking me, my husband, my family.
“Never happened. Lets agree to disagree on that one.”
I know that you are angry at Avantair, but where does it end.
“Angry? Hardly. Entertainment? Priceless! Where does it end? It ends when your kids get their dad back. But they could pay me my money for the sick days I earned but wasn’t allowed to use. That was illegal.”
Our children are part of the Avantair family. Are they, too, valid targets?
“I would have to say Yes, they are valid targets since the company you now love so much just took their father away from them for another month each year. Now they get to see dad 5 months per year instead of 6 months per year. But hey, we need to keep the stockholders happy, not the kids…..right?”
Do you have a Girlfriend, a Wife, Children?
“Wife. She calls me “hubby” sometimes.”
How would you feel if someone was doing this to them? Again, not an attack. Just a question.
“Easy answer. I hold her accountable for her actions. If she decides to play with the boys, she needs to expect to get treated like the boys. She doesn’t carry a victim mentality.”
2) Do you have anything at all positive to say about Avantair in your posts?
“The very first words out of my mouth about this company were good words. Again, use that intellect and education that I know you have and actually READ it. http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/fractional/39708-review-avantair.html
This one……I could use an apology on since you didn’t even bother to read anything:”
Can you at least admit that there are a lot of great people there?
“Nearly everyone I met there seemed to be great people. I would list their names but Vagabond wouldn’t like that. Only YOU get to use people’s names. J”
Do you think all managers there are evil, even after I told you told you some of our personal true stories. Do you think I made them up? I gave you negative and positive, but do you not care about the positive too? Not an attack, valid question.
“No, they arern’t all evil. But, about 90% of the pilots I flew with didn’t like the D.O. No one I speak with today likes the fact that the CEO negotiated himself a compensation package of nearly $1,000,000 this year while your kids were forced to do without dad even MORE. Do the Christmas presents and stuff like that make up for it? You decide. Lets your kids decide. Those are personal choices.”
3) What is your goal here? Do you wish for the ultimate destruction of Avantair, even if it means every pilot, your former friends and coworkers, will be on the street?
“My goal? I don’t have one. This is simply dialogue. I need all companies to succeed and have great contracts for their pilots. That is why UPS757 posted to you (to everyone) that the best thing your husband can do is to vote yes on unionizing the pilot group at Avantair. It helps the industry as a whole. Your second question doesn’t deserve an answer.”
You may have a valid gripe against this company, but where does this end? Not an attack, valid question only.
“You asked this above and I answered it above.”
4) If Avantair was like you say, and my Husband was now in jeopardy because of me, wouldn't you be at least partially responsible for his demise by twisting my words.
“No, you did all of the damage with your first post, then apparently posted your family name too. The D.O. told me personally that he reads these forums every day and he has friends who are moderators. YOU are 100% responsible if they retaliate. Either way, I am still proud of you for standing up and being counted.”
Would you not be hurting a fellow pilot and his family? Why would you do that? What would it accomplish in your fight against Avantair? Again, I'm not yelling, just asking. Not an attack.
“I am insignificant on Avantair’s radar scope. You give me WAAAAAY too much credit.”
5) We don't dispute that they might owe you some money, but why go after your friends. Badmouthing the company can't be helping your friends there? Does it? Not an attack.
”Name one friend that I have gone after? Then I can address your question.”
6) Are you trying to somehow help the Avantair pilots?
“No offense, but again, you don’t know what you don’t know.”
My husband says that your information is often incorrect and misleading..
“Then have him grow some and challenge me. Tell him to stand up and be counted! Does he ever tell you that my information is often right on the money and he is too scared for his job to give me credit here? I will patiently wait for your answer on that question.”
Not always. And that you use your alter ego trxline to keep posts active between your other username.
“He doesn’t appear to be as smart as you are. I have only one username.”
They get it, you are angry at the company, but where does it end. Do the ends justify the means?
“For the 3rd time, I already answered this question.”
Can you look yourself proudly knowing you attacked a pilot and his family?
“What pilot and his family did I attack? That’s a pretty dramatic statement, wouldn’t you say?
Is that really worth compromising just to get back at Avantair? I can tell you that if you are trying to help them, that your efforts are not respected and appreciated by the way you have gone about this. Wouldn't you rather regain their respect? Again, not attacks.
“I get plenty of appreciation from current pilots at Avantair. They feed me tons of information. They know that they will be fired if they speak for themselves. Just because your husband isn’t one of them doesn’t matter to me. Hell, he thinks I am trxline. He isn’t trustworthy. I don’t want his support until he wises up.”
Kyle, I would ask if you will answer those questions and then, I would really like to know if you will be willing to let this end here.
“I did answer your questions as requested. Let what end? I support the union just like you did in your original post. If you don’t like what you read here, don’t participate. Now that you have turned this union thread into a thread about me……..LOLOLOLOL Nice deflection!”
Thank you in advance,
“My pleasure.”
Debb
“BeenThereDoneIt”
12-15-2010, 07:16 PM
#35
APC co-founder
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: B777
Posts: 5,853
Originally Posted by nfnsquared
I'm a bit confused. Can you elaborate? There is nothing in the Terms of Service that says posting of a company's internal communications is prohibited.
Originally Posted by nfnsquared
Ah yes, when the Terms of Service does not specify, one must be able to read an individual MOD's mind.
That exactly what I expected you to say.
That exactly what I expected you to say.
Originally Posted by nfnsquared
It's not the rules that I dislike.....
We always welcome constructive criticism, but if you want to make it personal, I'd remind you that your a guest here and that you're not welcome.
Originally Posted by trxline
It's just like Avantair's forum.
You can post in the spirit of free communication, but if its true and they don't like it, they'll call you in for an intimidation session. "ie" How did you vote on the 14/14, or you know you have training coming up.
Good Stuff!
You can post in the spirit of free communication, but if its true and they don't like it, they'll call you in for an intimidation session. "ie" How did you vote on the 14/14, or you know you have training coming up.
Good Stuff!
This is private forum, we have a terms of service that work pretty well for the overall APC community, we enforce the terms of service.
We encourage a healthy debate as differing opinions are the catalyst for change. However, when it becomes personal and/or the "debate" erodes into an unproductive food fight we absolutely reserve the right to remove posts, threads, and users.
12-15-2010, 10:42 PM
#37
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 158
Avantairs next strategy? They will probably start some crap about how they finally hear the pilots and will start making all these new changes to better the pilots lives.....blah blah blah, barf, puke. Maybe raffle off some Volkswagons.....LOLOLOL. Dum Dums will fall for it and vote "no" on the union. Smart pilots will know better and bring on the union.
Lets see if my prediction comes true..........
Lets see if my prediction comes true..........
12-16-2010, 09:00 AM
#38
New Hire
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by BeenThereDoneIt
Topgun.......ANY contract that protects pilots from having to fly broken planes, violating the GOM at company request, getting fired for calling in sick or fatigued is a good contract.
Still waitnig, if you come up with one please feel free to post. As for flying broken planes, why would any pilot fly a broken plane, all you have to do is write it up and guess what it's grounded. If this happened to you why did you not "stand up" and say something or can you only do that when you are hidding behind the web.
12-16-2010, 03:16 PM
#39
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 158
Topgun.....Netjets started with the Teamsters, not in-house. Avantair pilots do not have the resources at this time to represent themselves in-house.
As far as flying broken planes, I was asked several times to fly broken planes. In each situation I made a decision to NOT fly if the plane was unairworthy. Other pilots are posting here that they are pressured to fly broken planes. I agree with you....write it up. However.... Avantair forbids its pilots from writing up planes until after they have spoken with the company. A nice union contract will change that policy.
As far as flying broken planes, I was asked several times to fly broken planes. In each situation I made a decision to NOT fly if the plane was unairworthy. Other pilots are posting here that they are pressured to fly broken planes. I agree with you....write it up. However.... Avantair forbids its pilots from writing up planes until after they have spoken with the company. A nice union contract will change that policy.
12-16-2010, 04:40 PM
#40
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 11
Debkeller, I'm afraid that any kind of reasonable dialogue with BTDI is not possible. I believe that he will simply twist what you say to suite his own lies. For reasons that no one understands clearly, he seems to hate anything to do with Avantair, and wants to hurt the company and all of its employees at any cost. Attacking the wife of one of our pilots is a new low, but I am not surprised. You were just a new target. It is your choice of course, but I believe that he has sunk so low that the best thing to do is leave him alone. Sad, I know. All the best.
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Bill Lumberg
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07-02-2008 06:08 AM
