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12-10-2018, 11:44 AM

#41

SFA320

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Joined APC: Nov 2016

Posts: 541

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary et al

Except that slide is inaccurate. It leads one to believe that a 2 year FO will get 47k. That is not the case. A 2 yr FO wont even get 20k. It really is sad that the union is blatantly lying to us. Why? I don't know, but I have no trust in the company, and no faith in our union leadership.

The lies and skewed facts from the union are yet another factor that should make one question their motives and the value of this contract.

The slide shows a 2 year FO progressing to a 5 year FO during negotiations. So the 47k is for 5 year FOs, you are NOT being lied to. I’m not sure why I had to explain it. The slide is 100% clear.

12-10-2018, 12:13 PM

#42

Trowserchilli

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Joined APC: Jun 2016

Posts: 629

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pizza Pilot

Dude, stop with ‘the sky is falling’ PBS ****. You have no idea how that’s gonna play out. Aside from that, Many if you want United rates straight away. It don’t work like that homies. You need to at least get yourself back in the game first. This at least does that. You don’t walk 15 miles into the woods and turn around and you’re out. It takes time. Some of you need a reality check. Like I said, the duration is way too long though

Sorry it is a fact, PBS decreases the total number of pilots needed.

I’ve never mentioned anything about United pay.

This deal shouldn’t have one item below Spirits current deal that was negotiated a year ago under a TRO. It should be Spirit plus.
That’s not unreasonable.

12-10-2018, 12:34 PM

#43

Pizza Pilot

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Joined APC: Nov 2018

Posts: 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trowserchilli

I agree completely with the last sentiment. It absolutely shoulda been Spirit plus. Honestly, I do believe the union could and should have done better in many areas. As far as PBS, it does make the company more efficient, but it will also help the reserve guys/gals qol by creating more lines. From my understanding, Frontier has a ton of orders and wants to grow exponentially. PBS isn’t as bad as many of you think it is. On the contrary, it can be pretty damn good. Of course language (or lack thereof) is the key factor, and that’s what worries me. Again, that’s what has me scratching my head about what the union agreed to. At any rate, get back in the game and elect new leadership. Next go around, go for broke.

12-10-2018, 12:53 PM

#44

RustyChain

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Joined APC: Mar 2015

Posts: 514

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReserveCA

Why cave.why cave.why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why why..................wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

This whole forum has jumped the shark.

12-10-2018, 01:05 PM

#45

V1 McFlyerson

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Joined APC: Jan 2018

Posts: 461

Quote:

Originally Posted by SFA320

The slide shows a 2 year FO progressing to a 5 year FO during negotiations. So the 47k is for 5 year FOs, you are NOT being lied to. I’m not sure why I had to explain it. The slide is 100% clear.

What about slide 41? Is the nc/mec trying to slide that one by the group or is that just another honest mistake like the 5 hour duty period bullet point?

Current Contract:

Quote:

B. If, in the opinion of the Company, a Pilot develops a medical
impairment to the Pilot's ability to perform Pilot duties between
routine physical examinations as required by this Section, the
Company shall have the right to require said Pilot to submit to a
medical examination from a medical examiner of the Pilot's
choice. If the Pilot fails to specify a medical examiner, the
Company shall choose a medical examiner. The financial
responsibility for the requested examination shall be borne by:
1. The Company, if the Pilot is examined by a medical
examiner specified by the Company.
2. The Pilot, if the Pilot is examined by a medical examiner
specified by the Pilot.

12-10-2018, 01:06 PM

#46

HeisenbergBlue

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Joined APC: Dec 2018

Posts: 268

Soooo I count about 7 No voters all echoing each other back and forth.

This contract will bring pilots in. The classes are only getting bigger and we just announced we were voting. If it passes we will be flush just like Spirit was.

12-10-2018, 04:32 PM

#47

Planepirate

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Joined APC: May 2017

Posts: 227

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trowserchilli

The TRO didn’t affect anything with the spirit TA. Frontiers lack of a TRO didn’t affect your TA.

12-10-2018, 04:41 PM

#48

RustyChain

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Joined APC: Mar 2015

Posts: 514

Quote:

Originally Posted by Planepirate

The TRO didn’t affect anything with the spirit TA. Frontiers lack of a TRO didn’t affect your TA.

I dont know how to could know such a thing.

12-10-2018, 05:46 PM

#49

CantStayAway

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Joined APC: Nov 2016

Posts: 617

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pizza Pilot

As far as PBS, it does make the company more efficient, but it will also help the reserve guys/gals qol by creating more lines.

I’m not sure how you figure this.

Number 1, we don’t know the target/min/max line values yet. That will be negotiated by an arbitrator at a later date. The higher those numbers, the less lines built. Number 2, the TA requires 4% of open time to remain after all lines are built. That already will require less lines than current book. Number 3, the TA allows the company to withhold up to 10% of flying from being able to be bid on by FOs due to the need for training.

The fact that there is language preventing downgrades as a result of implementing PBS should provide further proof that less lines will be created.

12-10-2018, 06:10 PM

#50

Planepirate

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Joined APC: May 2017

Posts: 227

Quote:

Originally Posted by RustyChain

I dont know how to could know such a thing.

Well you never really know what could have been. But this notion of “I was a good boy and therefore Santa should bring me lots of presents” is naive at best. A TRO is a nothing more than a court order to do what you were supposed to be doing all along (keeping the status quo). That way negotiations can continue without negative business repercussions. Frontier Pilots lack of a TRO did not result in a release to strike did it?