Since you asked in 2 different threads, I'll refer you to the other for my answer.

A bottle of water at Costco is approximately $0.25...

The same bottle in the supermarket is worth about $1.

The same bottle in a bar costs $2.

In a good restaurant or hotel, it can be worth up to $3.

At an airport or on the plane, you may be charged $5.

The bottle and the brand is the same, the only thing that changes is the place.

Each place gives a different value to the same product.

When you feel like you are worth nothing and everyone around you belittles you, change places, do not stay there.

Have the courage to change places and go to a place where you are given the value you deserve.

Surround yourself with people who really appreciate your worth.

Don't settle for less.

- Anonymous

On a similar note, I just listened to BL's propagada video BB forces him to present to the pilot group at the risk of jeopardizing his job. While I question BL's veracity, I await our NC's response to BL's allegations, but particularly the allegation our NC failed and/or refused to produce cogent data surrouning compensation proposals above and beyond a simplistic bullet point presentation. Is it true our NC asked for pay rates greater than current legacy rates for the same equipment at legacy carriers? From what I received via email from our NC, the rates proposed were on par with average legacy rates for the A320/321. Personally, I do not espouse F9 simply "can't afford to pay current industry wages" owing to F9's alleged lower (by comparison) annual revenue. Hit up Indigo for funding! Funding Indigo is certainly a line item on F9's Income Statement and Statement of Cash Flows. The same exact strategy Indigo is employing was employed by Frank Lorenzo 30 years ago alleging Eastern "could not afford" to pay better wages to the mechanics (IAM) and pilots (ALPA). Fact of the matter, Texas Air was deliberatly siphoning money from EAL (which was profitable) for the sole purpose of asserting the argument EAL is losing money, which was far from the truth. Franke is no dummy, his firm is handsomely compensated. Franke knows how to manage a balance sheet like it's nobody's business, he can quote GAAP and FASB in his sleep.

I trust our NC will "fact check" all of BL's assertions, and if what BL asserts has foundation, I would expect our NC to take ownership, produce meaningful financial data, and present it to BL AND the pilot group. One great way to unite our already fractured pilot group would be our NC begin being exceedingly transparent and provide frequent and meaningful (maybe a weekly voice message) communications. The current monthly emails lack value and almost always further demotivate the troops. A failure to respond to BL allegations is tantamount to an admission of guilt. Time is money. We will never get what we deserve but we will get what we negotiate.

Maybe I’ve been watching too much Pawn Stars lately, but it could be just a negotiating tactic.
-Start out aggressive
-Get low balled
-Evaluate everything else in the contract.
-Meet rates in the middle (Delta +1%)

:confused:

While attrition may be perceived as our biggest weapon in our arsenal of negotiation, I propose our NC firmly attack the credibility of the arguments asserted by those across the table. Drill deep down each and every assertion BL and his bought and paid for cronies assert. Are the arguments asserted by BL accepted upon information and belief, or verifiably true and correct? Publicly publish any and all false statements or misrepresntations asserted by opposing negotiatiors; to include, but not limited to who said what and when versus the verifiable facts. Let the pilot group be the jury. I don't think it's a monumental task to discredit patently baseless assertions, or even the sin of ommission. We are not curing cancer, we are forensically investigating opposing arguments and assertions. Keep fastidious records of each and every false assertion (for the purpose of presenting evidence to a judge or judicial officer during mediation or for the purpose of requesting self-help). Soon we might find those on the other side having less leverage than they want you to believe. Think long-term strategy.

I try to avoid posting here but this is important.

Let’s fact check BL ourselves. He says F9 ALPA proposed pay rates higher than legacy 320 rates.

Well, I just so happen to have United’s 2024 pay table right here: https://d2r1lrrqctgamh.cloudfront.net/UAL/TA/upa23-2023-09-29.pdf

UA 2024 Airbus rates for 12 year captain are as follows:

A319,A319neo,A320,A320neo all pay $358.97

A321: $360.85

A321neo,A321xlr: $374.36

F9 ALPA did not propose separate pay rates for each variant of the A320 family but rather proposed one blended rate for all A320 types.

the 2024 F9 12 year captain proposed rate is $364.90.

so yes, on the surface ALPA proposed a higher rate than “legacy A320” pay rates (notice BL didn’t mention 321s? Convenient.)

BUT!! What if you average out the three different United rates into one blended rate? It comes to $364.73. So F9 ALPA asked for a whopping 17 CENTS more per hour.

BL is a lying union buster. He is intentionally twisting and misrepresenting facts to undermine our union’s efforts.

Everytime you read or watch something from BL or any other management stooge, do so with this at the forefront of your mind: these management stooges are actively trying to suppress and destroy your pay and quality of life in order to line their own pockets off your hard work. They are not working with you but actively working directly against you.

The union put out a pretty good "here's what we're asking" on the Union website. Of course, it's close hold but you can go there and view. I for one thought it wasn't enough...

Isn't our proposed future fleet MOSTLY 321s?

yes. Which makes our proposed rates a bargain for the company.

Thank you for taking the your time an effort to produce relevant information. Notwithstanding Jake O (Dir of Training), I believe 99.99% of the line pilot group would agree with your assessment of BL:

"BL is a lying union buster. He is intentionally twisting and misrepresenting facts to undermine our union’s efforts.

Everytime you read or watch something from BL or any other management stooge, do so with this at the forefront of your mind: these management stooges are actively trying to suppress and destroy your pay and quality of life in order to line their own pockets off your hard work. They are not working with you but actively working directly against you."

One can almost see the pain on BL's face, gritting his teeth as he knowingly spews propoganda. The best defense is a strong offense. The shell and nut game strategy being employed by opposing nego. team must be stopped and each and every false statemtment be called out and memorialized - this applies to both sides of the table. It's debatable whether or not BB and BL have a moral compass, but it's far more likely their duplicitous tactics would be bridled and their enormous ego humbled if publicly shamed for presenting known false and/or misleading statements as fact. Credibilty is everything, especially in legal matters.