GoJet hiring or just taking applications???
10-20-2009, 07:45 AM
#11
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Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: MD80
Posts: 1,111
Originally Posted by SrfNFly227
So I am sure that this will turn into a GoJet bashing thread, and I want to say that this is not my intention. I started this thread for two reasons. One, was just to ask exactly what the title says. Here is some of this morning's post from an aviation job website.
Details
Thank you for your interest in a career opportunity with GoJet Airlines. GoJet is a St.
Louis-based regional all-jet airline operating as United Express. GoJet Airlines is proud to be
partnered with United Airlines, one of the largest airlines in the world. GoJet's fleet consists
of the 66-seat Bombardier CRJ700 aircraft, which features three classes of service.
We take pride in our culture of innovation and we are constantly looking for like-minded,
dynamic individuals to come and join our rapidly expanding team.
If you wish to submit your application, please send it via e-mail or fax it to the number
listed below.
Send résumés to:
GoJet Airlines Recruiting
11495 Navaid Road, Suite 133
Bridgeton, MO 63044
Phone (Pilots): 314-222-4395
Fax: 314-222-4399
E-mail: [email protected]
Second reason for this post is to point out the experience that is required. I just can't believe that in today's environment, with the media attention on low time pilots and the simple fact that thousands of people with experience in the thousands of hours, that GoJet would still be hiring street captains or low time FO's.
•Experience
◦First Officer
1000 hours Fixed-wing flight time
200 hours Multi-engine flight time
Turbine experience preferred
With jet or airline training course lower flight times will be considered
◦Captain
4500 hours Fixed-wing flight time
1000 hours Multi-engine flight time
1000 hours turbine flight time
Details
Thank you for your interest in a career opportunity with GoJet Airlines. GoJet is a St.
Louis-based regional all-jet airline operating as United Express. GoJet Airlines is proud to be
partnered with United Airlines, one of the largest airlines in the world. GoJet's fleet consists
of the 66-seat Bombardier CRJ700 aircraft, which features three classes of service.
We take pride in our culture of innovation and we are constantly looking for like-minded,
dynamic individuals to come and join our rapidly expanding team.
If you wish to submit your application, please send it via e-mail or fax it to the number
listed below.
Send résumés to:
GoJet Airlines Recruiting
11495 Navaid Road, Suite 133
Bridgeton, MO 63044
Phone (Pilots): 314-222-4395
Fax: 314-222-4399
E-mail: [email protected]
Second reason for this post is to point out the experience that is required. I just can't believe that in today's environment, with the media attention on low time pilots and the simple fact that thousands of people with experience in the thousands of hours, that GoJet would still be hiring street captains or low time FO's.
•Experience
◦First Officer
1000 hours Fixed-wing flight time
200 hours Multi-engine flight time
Turbine experience preferred
With jet or airline training course lower flight times will be considered
◦Captain
4500 hours Fixed-wing flight time
1000 hours Multi-engine flight time
1000 hours turbine flight time
10-20-2009, 07:46 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: CRJ-200 First Officer
Posts: 262
Originally Posted by bryris
Used to be you could put in 5-6 years and 4-5k hours /w good PIC and get out. But, I wouldn't hold your breath to get off this stepping stone anytime soon. Mathematically, if you are young, you'll make it someday (in theory).
However, with the increasing allocation of major airline flying going to the regionals, the continually dropping bar of wages and QOL, the acclamation of the public to the low ticket prices (isn't undone quickly), the slew of pilots on furlough right now, the slew of current RJ captains with their stakes in the turf, etc - it'll be a loooong time before anyone who sits right seat in a RJ or even lower down the professional totem pole will make it to a major - at least in this country.
However, with the increasing allocation of major airline flying going to the regionals, the continually dropping bar of wages and QOL, the acclamation of the public to the low ticket prices (isn't undone quickly), the slew of pilots on furlough right now, the slew of current RJ captains with their stakes in the turf, etc - it'll be a loooong time before anyone who sits right seat in a RJ or even lower down the professional totem pole will make it to a major - at least in this country.
First: Regional pilots need to negotiate for the best contracts we can so that their costs rise and we look less appeasing to the management at the majors. In order to do that pilots have to stop going to places like GoJet because it completely undermines the ability of everyone else to negotiate better contracts. Our management will simply say: "Well look at these GoJet guys they will fly for these wages with out any work rules, how come you guys won't?"
Secondly: Major pilots need to shore up scope and protect against codeshares (watch out for future RAH 100 seat codeshares) as much as possible so that the jobs can't be farmed easily or at all.
You can't put all the blame on either regional or major pilots, everyone has blood on their hands. We can't undo the past either. However we all know what is coming next, the 100 seat "RJ." We need to work now to make it as unattractive as possible for management to give those aircraft to regionals.
It is not an easy battle and it is not one that will be won in a year or even a decade. It is a battle that will be won one contract at a time.
10-20-2009, 08:01 AM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 168
Originally Posted by FlyASA
You are absolutely right it is not undone quickly. The profession didn't start it's downward slide overnight either. We need to attack on two fronts.
First: Regional pilots need to negotiate for the best contracts we can so that their costs rise and we look less appeasing to the management at the majors. In order to do that pilots have to stop going to places like GoJet because it completely undermines the ability of everyone else to negotiate better contracts. Our management will simply say: "Well look at these GoJet guys they will fly for these wages with out any work rules, how come you guys won't?"
Secondly: Major pilots need to shore up scope and protect against codeshares (watch out for future RAH 100 seat codeshares) as much as possible so that the jobs can't be farmed easily or at all.
You can't put all the blame on either regional or major pilots, everyone has blood on their hands. We can't undo the past either. However we all know what is coming next, the 100 seat "RJ." We need to work now to make it as unattractive as possible for management to give those aircraft to regionals.
It is not an easy battle and it is not one that will be won in a year or even a decade. It is a battle that will be won one contract at a time.
First: Regional pilots need to negotiate for the best contracts we can so that their costs rise and we look less appeasing to the management at the majors. In order to do that pilots have to stop going to places like GoJet because it completely undermines the ability of everyone else to negotiate better contracts. Our management will simply say: "Well look at these GoJet guys they will fly for these wages with out any work rules, how come you guys won't?"
Secondly: Major pilots need to shore up scope and protect against codeshares (watch out for future RAH 100 seat codeshares) as much as possible so that the jobs can't be farmed easily or at all.
You can't put all the blame on either regional or major pilots, everyone has blood on their hands. We can't undo the past either. However we all know what is coming next, the 100 seat "RJ." We need to work now to make it as unattractive as possible for management to give those aircraft to regionals.
It is not an easy battle and it is not one that will be won in a year or even a decade. It is a battle that will be won one contract at a time.
I think with the atp deal, it will put places like gojet, mesa, etc. in a very tough spot, potentially out of business. If the minimums are level across the board, and you meet the minimums for a great, ok, or junk regional, which one would you choose?
10-20-2009, 08:04 AM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2008
Position: Hotel
Posts: 714
Originally Posted by FlyASA
You are absolutely right it is not undone quickly. The profession didn't start it's downward slide overnight either. We need to attack on two fronts.
First: Regional pilots need to negotiate for the best contracts we can so that their costs rise and we look less appeasing to the management at the majors. In order to do that pilots have to stop going to places like GoJet because it completely undermines the ability of everyone else to negotiate better contracts. Our management will simply say: "Well look at these GoJet guys they will fly for these wages with out any work rules, how come you guys won't?"
Secondly: Major pilots need to shore up scope and protect against codeshares (watch out for future RAH 100 seat codeshares) as much as possible so that the jobs can't be farmed easily or at all.
You can't put all the blame on either regional or major pilots, everyone has blood on their hands. We can't undo the past either. However we all know what is coming next, the 100 seat "RJ." We need to work now to make it as unattractive as possible for management to give those aircraft to regionals.
It is not an easy battle and it is not one that will be won in a year or even a decade. It is a battle that will be won one contract at a time.
First: Regional pilots need to negotiate for the best contracts we can so that their costs rise and we look less appeasing to the management at the majors. In order to do that pilots have to stop going to places like GoJet because it completely undermines the ability of everyone else to negotiate better contracts. Our management will simply say: "Well look at these GoJet guys they will fly for these wages with out any work rules, how come you guys won't?"
Secondly: Major pilots need to shore up scope and protect against codeshares (watch out for future RAH 100 seat codeshares) as much as possible so that the jobs can't be farmed easily or at all.
You can't put all the blame on either regional or major pilots, everyone has blood on their hands. We can't undo the past either. However we all know what is coming next, the 100 seat "RJ." We need to work now to make it as unattractive as possible for management to give those aircraft to regionals.
It is not an easy battle and it is not one that will be won in a year or even a decade. It is a battle that will be won one contract at a time.
Controlling a huge crowd, the communication required, and the nads required by everyone involved would prevent this from ever happening. Not to mention the RLA.
The contract idea is the better choice, obviously. However, this is a HUGE upward battle for all the reasons I've said on this board. As a group, pilots WILL fly for nothing. On an individual level, we'll all make our own choices, but as a group mass, people would fly for $10/hour - I guarantee it. (Remember GSA?) They'd harp about the quick upgrade time, the pay will get better later, or whatever else to justify it.
Furthermore, in a contracting demand situation we are confronted with, with a surplus of pilots available, the leverage just doesn't exist right now.
But, as you so aptly pointed out, it will take time - lots of time, if it can be done at all.
10-20-2009, 08:09 AM
#15
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Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: MD80
Posts: 1,111
Originally Posted by nigelcobalt
If the minimums are level across the board, and you meet the minimums for a great, ok, or junk regional, which one would you choose?
10-20-2009, 09:46 AM
#16
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Joined APC: Jan 2008
Posts: 888
Originally Posted by AirWillie
For a regional? Probably the one that is closest to my house.
10-20-2009, 10:45 AM
#17
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Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: none ya...
Posts: 1,154
Originally Posted by Blueskies21
If it was anyone else I might think they were joking. Sadly I know you're not.
Ok, my question is this, whether you agree or not, What is wrong with a pilot determining that QOL issues are more important than pay when he selects a carrier. I personally am more about QOL.
10-20-2009, 10:49 AM
#18
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Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: seated beer curl
Posts: 406
Originally Posted by FlyASA
I'm sorry for working for a regional, please point me in the direction of the major airline that hires flight instructors and I'll quit immediately....please I'm waiting.....didn't think so....
The regionals are a stepping stone, everyone knows that but that doesn't mean we have to choose to work for the worst ones, especially an alter-ego that was set up to circumvent contract negotiations. What kind of message does that send to the Tilton's of the world that are itching to set up alter-egos at the mainline level?
We all talk about educating people about the industry so what's wrong with educating people about the history of GoJet? Isn't that something they should know before they go there?
[/QUOTE]
10-20-2009, 11:02 AM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2008
Position: Hotel
Posts: 714
The reality is that management doesn't care about messages. If they can make more money with a tactic that is legal, they'll do it. The Gojet thing was legal, despite the ripples it created. You think Hulas gives a crap about what the pilots think while he's relaxing on his beach front veranda with martini in hand?
10-20-2009, 12:01 PM
#20
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Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: CRJ-200 First Officer
Posts: 262
Originally Posted by LeftWing
The exact same thing can be said by a GoJet pilot.
Originally Posted by LeftWing
Who are you to say which regionals are the worst ones? Sure, GJ was created under questionable circumstances and perhaps the initial group of pilots had questionable ethics for working for GJ just to get a relative seniority windfall. Since then, the GoJet pilots voted in a union and negotiated their own contract, remember? That doesn't send a message to management?
You are missing the big point. It's about raising the bar and gaining industry leading contracts. There is nothing industry leading about their contract. The only thing the creation of GoJets and their seperate list has done is given Hulas the ability to whipsaw two pilot groups against each other when the new MRJs come.
How is either group supposed to get better QOL, pay, benefits, etc. with that hanging over their heads?
Originally Posted by LeftWing
There is nothing wrong with educating as long as you keep it in perspective (and don't hijack threads in your crusade). If GoJet is hiring, there is zero difference between you and a GJ new-hire. Those that hired on since the initial group has as much justification as a new-hire at ASA (if they were hiring) for taking the job. The message to management is ultimately the same.
The TSA pilots wanted better rates to fly the CRJ-700s and they could have flown them on the GoJet certificate with out scope problems with American (RAH does it everyday) but Hulas managed to set up GoJet with a seperate seniority list and staff it with people willing to work for less. How can you not see that as a problem? It sets the same dangerous precedent that Freedom did, but at least Mesa was able to rein that in.
The only thing similar between a newhire at ASA and a newhire at GoJet is the 1st year pay. What about 2nd year, 3rd year, etc. The ASA pilot also has better work rules too.
We have nothing near a mainline contract but our last contract was a small step in the right direction. The creation of GoJet was a step backwards and them having a crappy union and contract doesn't make up for it.
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