B6 gives out bonus surprisingly to pilots
01-10-2018, 08:22 AM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: Square root of the variance and average of the variation
Posts: 1,602
Originally Posted by AYLflyer
Yeah, I'm thrilled that I'm underpaid compared to my peers. That's not what this is about though. You can create whatever narrative you want, you're still *****ing about the company giving you something. What would you have said if everyone EXCEPT the pilots got $1000?
What's that saying? Pay a pilot in gold bars and he'll complain?
The same voices on here keep spewing the same crap. Very woe-is-me and divisive. Wonder why more people don't post on here? Probably because if you disagree with the 4 or 5 primary voices you'll be called a juicer and told that you're sleeping with management.
I don't RSA, I don't VDA. I don't wear blue gloves. I don't clean cabins. I don't fly tired. I don't extend. I work my schedule, go home and repeat.
That doesn't mean I can't be happy that I and every other employee who is working their asses off here is getting an extra $1000 bucks in their check. $1000 might not mean jack-**** to some of us pilots who are pulling in $100k+ yr but the gate agents, in flight etc who are making next to nothing, that's a pretty nice bonus for them. I want a contract just as bad as the next guy, but I'm not going to get upset, or make up a reason to be mad because there's an extra grand in my check for a month.
If you're so offended and upset about it, why not donate that $1000 to someone? Maybe a tech ops, GO, In flight, someone who needs it more than you apparently?
I'll be at the rally on the 31st carrying a sign fighting for a market rate contract on my day off, hope the guys who are crying the loudest here will be there too.
What's that saying? Pay a pilot in gold bars and he'll complain?
The same voices on here keep spewing the same crap. Very woe-is-me and divisive. Wonder why more people don't post on here? Probably because if you disagree with the 4 or 5 primary voices you'll be called a juicer and told that you're sleeping with management.
I don't RSA, I don't VDA. I don't wear blue gloves. I don't clean cabins. I don't fly tired. I don't extend. I work my schedule, go home and repeat.
That doesn't mean I can't be happy that I and every other employee who is working their asses off here is getting an extra $1000 bucks in their check. $1000 might not mean jack-**** to some of us pilots who are pulling in $100k+ yr but the gate agents, in flight etc who are making next to nothing, that's a pretty nice bonus for them. I want a contract just as bad as the next guy, but I'm not going to get upset, or make up a reason to be mad because there's an extra grand in my check for a month.
If you're so offended and upset about it, why not donate that $1000 to someone? Maybe a tech ops, GO, In flight, someone who needs it more than you apparently?
I'll be at the rally on the 31st carrying a sign fighting for a market rate contract on my day off, hope the guys who are crying the loudest here will be there too.
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
01-10-2018, 08:24 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: Left,Right, Left, Right,Right,Left, Right, Left
Posts: 3,150
Again... This isn't the I had a hard life forum... it's airline pilot forums. Airline pilot problems, not I eat govt cheese problems.
So you're ok with working harder for less than your peers doing the same job in the same equipment??
unbelievable the mediocrity you're willing to settle for...
Stop comparing yourself to every other job... this is not every other job.
YOU ARE A PROFESSIONAL.
and yes. If it's not market rate. strike. walk off, shut it down. If it comes to that, then it comes to that.
We, deserve better. You don't get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate.
StdDeviation your post is exactly what management wants to hear... you're willing to settle for less. It's pathetic.
So you're ok with working harder for less than your peers doing the same job in the same equipment??
unbelievable the mediocrity you're willing to settle for...
Stop comparing yourself to every other job... this is not every other job.
YOU ARE A PROFESSIONAL.
and yes. If it's not market rate. strike. walk off, shut it down. If it comes to that, then it comes to that.
We, deserve better. You don't get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate.
StdDeviation your post is exactly what management wants to hear... you're willing to settle for less. It's pathetic.
Last edited by CaptCoolHand; 01-10-2018 at 08:36 AM.
01-10-2018, 08:47 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 2,594
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Wake tf up.
01-10-2018, 09:18 AM
#34
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,886
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Your argument for not getting DL rates (DL, UAL and AA are all virtually identical) seems to be:
1. They have more pilots.
2. They have a higher market cap, in other words the total value of the company is higher.
As for more pilots, who cares? All that guarantees is they have more paychecks to write at that higher rate! It doesn't guarantee any other meaningful metric at all. They could be larger, yet still be a money losing enterprise!
As for market cap value, they are much larger corporations, and they are profitable, so it's not unusual that the big 3 have higher total market values. Market capitalization also fluctuates from one quarterly stock report to the next as Spirit and United have shown us recently. What does that matter? Those things aren't really relevant because they don't adjust for the scale of the operation. To say it another way, that metric alone doesn't provide enough information to gauge how profitable an enterprise is relative to it's size.
Profit margin, or how much profit we earn relative to each dollar of corporate revenue is a much more meaningful way to compare corporate profitability because it adjusts for scale, or at least it can show how smaller companies can be more profitable than a larger company relative to our size. That's us!
We earn more profit per dollar of revenue than the big 3. In the case of UAL and AA, a LOT more. We trade "highest margin" back and forth with SWA.
We can afford and should expect compensation in line with the big 4. And we have 1/4 the number of pilot paychecks to write at that comparable pay rate. You see, scale adjusted!
01-10-2018, 09:19 AM
#35
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
So what are you willing to accept SD? You choose to commute to a more affordable city. Good for you and that’s your choice. Those of us that don’t want to give up our free time live in base and our bases are in some of the most expensive cities in the US. I expect to be compensated accordingly. Does a bus driver in your city make the same as my city? Probably not. They’re most likely compensated higher here as it’s a higher cost of living city. So I actually expect to be paid the same as my peers at other airlines or more because we have no bases in low cost of living areas. I have very little control over how the company chooses to spend and make it's money. Should I as an airline pilot have to suffer for the lack of proper management at a company? Doesn’t really matter though as jetBlue continues to make record profits.
01-10-2018, 09:29 AM
#36
Banned
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,473
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
01-10-2018, 10:18 AM
#37
Not A Janitor
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 814
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
This has got to be one of the most ignorant things I've ever read on this forum. And that's saying something.
Yes. We will strike over that. The house will not burn down. It is flush with cash. It will still be flush with cash after you earn the contract you deserve.
01-10-2018, 10:43 AM
#38
Covfefe
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 3,001
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
01-10-2018, 02:19 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by BeatNavy
Are you serious? $1.25bil stock buybacks, highest profit margins in the industry, buying a321s with cash, paying down hundred of millions in debt ahead of schedule, and they can’t afford to pay pilots market rate? Do we get discounts vs delta on airbuses or fuel because we are a smaller leaner company? Should we get discounts on pilots, too? I hate that your vote counts the same as mine, but at least the NC/MEC isn’t as out to lunch as you and won’t let people like you tank our pilot group. You sir, need to get informed.
01-10-2018, 02:51 PM
#40
PermaFO
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Position: May I swing the gear Von Admiral?
Posts: 130
Originally Posted by Std Deviation
You forgot the, “they’re paying us poverty level wages for New York,” in your soliloquy. Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.
I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
Uh, no they’re not. I get what you’re saying. Heck for the FAs it’s a lot of money. So for a guy that grew up eating government cheese in Detroit, the 151K I grossed this past year with no RSA, VDA, etc. (includes the profit sharing and per diem) as a 3yr FO on 4th year pay puts me in the upper middle class.I hope I never get to the point where $100 is not significant to me. Disclaimer- yep, I’ll take more money but if we think we’re getting Delta rates that’s far fetched. Or, we can just burn the house down fighting over 30K on an income well into the six figures. Or, a quarter million dollars a year for captains. So let’s split the difference... 15K. We’re going to potentially strike over 15K because it’s not “industry average” on an industry comparison that has 4 times the pilots and way more market cap? Do I have this right? Please, pontificators enlighten me. Personally, you guys are going to walk off the job for 16K because it’s not 25K?
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