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American Eagle ALPA & AA APA Strike

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American Eagle ALPA & AA APA Strike

Old 11-17-2011, 09:11 AM
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Default American Eagle ALPA & AA APA Strike

ALPA American Eagle MEC and APA American Airlines have both been given Opportunitys at contracts. ALPA AE MEC will be voting soon on a TA. In contrast, APA has yet to come to an agreement on a TA.

Why not have an organized strike? AA flight attendants are also waiting on a TA. We will see in a few months the outcome of the AE ALPA vote on the TA. Both AE and AA need to strike.

You suppose Obama will just order us back to work? Okay...so what happens if every crew member refuses Obama's demand to return to work. We get fired? I'd like to say where will AMR find replacement pilots for AE or AA? But I guess there are several pilots at regionals that would love an opportunity at AA.

But it would be nice if unions had bargaining power similar to decades ago. Qantas couldn't even strike.

If AE and AA could organize a strike, we could send a signal to management. Even if Obama ordered us back to work it'll take several days. Meanwhile, the message has already been sent to AMR management. They need the message to stop pocketing millions while running the corporation poorly.
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Old 11-17-2011, 10:52 AM
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Wouldn't that be a quandary for Obama? Since unions were big donors to his campaign it would be interesting to see what kind of reaction he would get from the SEIU and other unions if he did order a striking airline union back to work.
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Old 11-17-2011, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by squawkoff
Wouldn't that be a quandary for Obama? Since unions were big donors to his campaign it would be interesting to see what kind of reaction he would get from the SEIU and other unions if he did order a striking airline union back to work.
Under the current AE pilot contract we are not allowed to strike, we gave that away under this contract.
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Old 11-17-2011, 11:28 AM
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There is no need for Eagle to strike. We have time left on an industry-leading contract. It is management that urgently wants to end that. Granted, there may be fewer and fewer working here under the contract if they follow through on threats to take airplanes away, but the contract itself is pretty good.
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Old 11-17-2011, 11:29 AM
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The AEPA has received numerous requests from pilots for the AEPA to comment on the American Eagle Airlines MEC Hotline of September 18, 2011 and the “824 Letter of Agreement”.

Although the AEPA is reluctant to comment on lies and innuendo a few statements in the documents bear minimal comment.

The entire Air Services Agreement “negotiations” are simply a manufactured ALPA and management “crisis” to “open” the Pilot Agreement negotiations before 2013.

Railway Labor Act Section 6 Title 1 negotiations to amend the Pilot Agreement were scheduled to “open” January 1, 2013 (see Pilot Agreement Section 30).

By 2013 the aviation industry will be a completely different industry than it is today. The pilot shortage will force airline managements to negotiate in earnest and good faith with the pilots in America.

ALPA and management have been manufacturing one “crisis” after another to amend the American Eagle Pilot Agreement. First it was the “divestiture”. Every American Eagle pilot is aware that the “divestiture” was just stupid rhetoric. AMR management is left with donating the so-called “Eagle shares” to the current shareholders of AMR Corporation (see SEC Form 10 filed by AMR Corporation). The “divestiture” of American Eagle Airlines is a clown show conducted by amateur clowns, both ALPA clowns and management clowns.

The “divestiture” threat failed to terrify the American Eagle pilots and so now what? The Air Services Agreement threat – AMR management is threatening to ship American Eagle Airlines flying to other regional competitors.

The new “crisis” manufactured by ALPA and management without a shred of evidence.

The MEC Hotline of September 18 included this lie. “a number of regional competitors have already inquired regarding bidding for AA feed flying”.

Really! Who? Dan Gartoon Airlines? Just another lie from ALPA and management unsupported by any evidence or facts - why not publish the letters from the regional competitors inquiring about feeding AA?

What – those letters are secret as well?

Here is another lie “if we can obtain a significantly better air services agreement”.
Significantly better than what, the current Air Services Agreement? Why has thecurrent Air Services Agreement not been released to the pilots or investing public so a legitimate comparison can be made between the two documents? How do the American Eagle pilots verify that the “significantly enhanced air services agreement” is really “enhanced”? The MEC Hotline makes the following statement “American Eagle management negotiated an air services agreement with American Airlines that webelieve to be sub-standard and potentially damaging to Eagle pilots”.

Really! Where is the evidence? If the Air Services Agreement negotiated by Dan Garton is sub-standard and damaging to the Eagle pilots then surely that sub-standard air services agreement will be damaging to the “divested” American Eagle Airlines and the “investors” in the “divested” American Eagle Airlines will be financially harmed. Why has ALPA not made a public announcement to warn potential “investors” that the “divested” American Eagle Airlines will have a “sub-standard” air services agreement?

Here is another lie from ALPA – “A number of pilots have commented that AA cannot possibly bid out jet feed that quickly. Our internal analyses show that may not be the case”.

What “internal analyses” and more importantly, what did the “internal analyses” show?
Once again no evidence and no supporting facts – just lies, innuendo and rhetoric!

Here is the biggest lie contained in the MEC Hotline.
“Seniority-Based Wage Scales - This may be the most complicated piece of this proposal. Because of the massive amount of forecasted attrition due to the flow-through, 824, and Protected Pilot agreements, the company stands to absorb a significant increase in training costs over its competitors”.

What massive attrition? The mythical“824 flow-through agreement” contains a metering clause that allows management to transfer none or as little as 20 American Eagle pilots per month to American Airlines, if operationally not disruptive.

Read the “824 Flow-Through Agreement” letter that ALPA hastily published on September 16 and analyze the following “contractual” clause in the letter notated as
1.b. The intent of this agreement is to provide 50% of the AA new hire training slots to 824 AE pilots in such a way that the AE operation is not disrupted

The intent of this agreement – the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Unfortunately good intentions are not contractually binding.

If there is an artist moonlighting as an American Eagle pilot please draw a cartoon of a management lawyer standing before an Arbitrator and explaining why none of the 824 “flow-through” pilots transferred to AA “Mr. Arbitrator, it was our intent to transfer the American Eagle pilots to American Airlines but it was just too disruptive to our operation!”

Here is a question from the AEPA, in reading the above clause 1.b. - IF the AE operation WILL be disrupted, how many 824 flow-through pilots must AE release and transfer to AA? Think legally and not emotionally.

The next contractual clause in the 824 Agreement is notated as
1.c. and states: As such, AE management will release no fewer than 20 AE pilots per month in a month in which AA is entering new hire pilots into training, in an effort to meet the 50%. If AE management determines that they can release more than 20 pilots in any given month, they will do so.

In an effort to meet the 50%! What happens if AE makes no effort to meet the 50%?

What compels AE to release any pilots in a month in which AA is entering new hire pilots into training when clause 1.b. states that AE pilots will be released in such a waythat the AE operation is not disrupted.

Legally, the As such does nothing to join clause 1.b to clause 1.c.

Even a first year law student would have written more precise legal language.

Maybe a first year law student would have written language to the effect of:
Notwithstanding the provision of 1.b. above and the potential disruption of the AE operation, AE management will release no fewer than 20 AE pilots per month, in a month in which AA is entering new hire pilots into training, to meet the minimum 50% requirement of this letter. AE Management is required to adhere to the staffing requirements of American Eagle Airlines Pilot Agreement in addition to the pilot staffing requirement necessary to meet the 50% threshold of this letter.

“[T]he company stands to absorb a significant increase in training costs over its competitors” is an unmitigated lie. During major airline hiring phases regional pilots have transferred to the major airlines in droves – every regional airline has at times lost more than 20 pilots a month. This “824 Flow-Through Agreement” is a shiny bauble that management is dangling in front of the American Eagle pilots to firstly, attract new hire pilots and secondly, to keep American Eagle pilots from seeking employment at United, Delta, Southwest, JetBlue and many foreign carriers.

Do not be fooled by the A financial bridge that will allow Eagle pilots to transition to other mainline carriers, including American Airlines, with minimal, if any loss in take home pay – it is a bridge to nowhere.

Management and ALPA are demanding that the American Eagle pilots pay for management’s inability to attract new hire pilots and retain the current and qualified Eagle pilots.

This entire charade by ALPA and management is nothing more than a repeat of the lies and broken promises of 1997.

In 1997 the American Eagle pilots were promised that every pilot on the property would transfer to American Airlines in 5 years. It is 2011, fifteen years later, and even though AA is training new hire pilots (TWA LLC pilots) 240 American Eagle Flow-Through pilots who hold AA seniority numbers are not being transferred to AA, even though AA is currently experiencing a pilot shortage.

Do not be fooled by the following MEC Hotline statement:

Lastly, as part of the new seniority wage band concept, we have proposed to remove the EMB 135 and 140 rates from our collective bargaining agreement and as a result, there will no longer be any blended EMB rates. Only the EMB-145 rate will remain. As a result, most EMB pilots, EMB reserve pilots in particular, will see an increase in their pay.

.The ATR and EMB 135/140 aircraft will be removed from flying at American Eagle Airlines or parked in the desert. That is why there will only be an EMB-145 rate. This is not a benefit to the pilots - the reduction in fleet size will eventually result in the furlough of junior pilots and the displacement of junior captains when the displacement training is completed.

The entire “Seniority-Based Wage Scales” are nothing more than an attempt by ALPA and management to inhibit training cycles and force the American Eagle pilots to pay for the training costs associated with the removal of the ATR and EMB 135/140 from the American Eagle Airlines’ fleet.

The biggest concessions, other than the eventual reduction in longevity pay, that ALPA and management are demanding from the American Eagle pilots is the following:

● Eight Year Duration with two Contract Amendment Rounds and the following sentence from sub-paragraph 3 of the Eight Year Duration clause.

♦ The difference between this amendment round and previous is that either party will be able, if they so need, to take wage scales and pilot longevity as single, specific items to interest arbitration.

American Eagle pilot wage scales and pilot longevity will, for the first time, be subjected to a downward “industry average” adjustment. The fact is that many regional carriers have not been in operation as long as American Eagle Airlines and do not have 18-year pay scales. It is possible that the “average” longevity at these start-up regional carriers is only 10-years. If this is true and based on the amendment round guidelines, the arbitrators will have no choice but to reduce American Eagle Airlines pay longevity scales to 10 years. Not only that, under the language that ALPA is proposing the Arbitrators would be given a one time shot at reducing the American Eagle pilot hourly pay rate. This is a major concession that was not even allowed by the “Old Guard” in the 16-year agreement of 1997.

The following is another bald-faced lie.
In order to secure a long-term air services agreement with AA, AA is requiring that Eagle maintain market-based costs for the duration of the ASA. Therefore, we are proposing that this new contract have an eight year duration that becomes amendable under Section 6 of the Railway Labor Act on January 1, 2020.

If American Airlines is requiring American Eagle Airlines to “maintain market-based costs for the duration of the ASA” what has that got to do with the pilots?

Why are the pilots giving AE an 8-year extension on a 16-year agreement?

Why is ALPA proposing a 8-year extension of the 16-year agreement?

What lies are ALPA and management trying to foist on the American Eagle pilots – if the pilots do not agree to an 8-year contract extension then AA will not give AE an air services agreement. Can you imagine Dan Gartoon trying to explain to the current shareholders of AMR who will be donated a share or shares of American Eagle Airlinesin the sham “divestiture”, that “… due to the pilots not agreeing to an 8-year extension, AA cannot agree to an air services agreement and therefore American Eagle Airlines has no aircraft and no flying to perform. You can frame the Eagle share certificate and thanks for playing”.

ALPA and management have not presented one iota of financial information from any of the “studies” conducted by Bain & Co., the investment bankers or the great union’s Financial and Economic Analyses Department. Below are some financial numbers that management has supplied to the Department of Transportation. Pilots can view this information on the RITA Research and Innovative Technology Administration: Bureau of Transportation Statistics website.

1Q 2011 American Eagle Airlines Cost per Available Seat Mile 18.1 cents
1Q 2011 American Eagle Airlines Revenue per Available Seat Mile 19.2 cents
1Q 2011 American Eagle Airlines Revenue Yield (per Revenue Pax. Mile) 27.2 cents

The American Eagle Airlines CRJ crew cost, using the highest Captain and First Officer pay rates and including all benefits at the highest rate per Available Seat Mile is 00.6 cents

If the American Eagle pilots worked for free it would reduce the American Eagle Airlines Cost per Available Seat Mile to (18.1 cents minus 00.6 cent) 17.5 cents

And ALPA and management demand that the pilots give management concessions to secure A significantly enhanced air services agreement and to ensure that American Eagle Airlines “maintains market based costs”.

What a load of crap.

American Eagle Airlines has the highest cost per available seat mile in the regional industry and the pilot cost percentage of the available seat mile cost is 3.3%

American Eagle Airlines Fuel Costs per Available Seat Mile is 6.77 cents and the fuel cost percentage of the available seat mile cost is 37.3 %

American Eagle Airlines has the highest fuel cost in the regional industry.
Why have management and ALPA not demanded that the fuel vendor reduce its fuel cost to American Eagle Airlines?

How dumb can the AEPA be you ask – the fuel vendor is American Airlines, why would they reduce the cost of fuel to American Eagle Airlines? The Eagle pilots have to pay for the margin above industry fuel cost to “maintain market-based costs” and not American Airlines.

It is very obvious from the above information that American Eagle Airlines is loaded with operating costs by American Airlines to reduce the net available seat mile operating profit (19.2 cents minus 18.1 cents = 1.1 cent) to enable ALPA and management to come crying to the Eagle pilots for concessions. The sad aspect is that many American Eagle pilots swallow the stuff from ALPA and management.

AMR Corporation is technically bankrupt and many industry pundits and gurus are beginning to realize that AMR is a financial basket case irrespective of the smoke and mirror gimmicks such as “divesting” American Eagle Airlines and “buying” 460 new jets. It did not take long for the financial community to realize that all the rhetoric was a public relations swindle. AMR Corporation shares at Market Close today were 3.32.
A person could not exchange an AMR share for a pack of two-ply ultra soft toilet tissue without being accused of ripping-off the tissue vendor.

In a Chapter 11 restructuring bankruptcy management will retain all the contractual concessions in the Pilot Agreement, the pilots will not be treated equally and will berequired to give management more contractual concession and forego many contractual provisions that do not suit management. The 824 Agreement is an example of a contractual provision that will disappear in an AMR Corporation Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

ALPA will lie to the potential 824 “flow-through” pilots and tell the pilots what they want to hear in order to secure 824 “flow-through” yes votes to the concessions. Remember, American Airlines has the right and ability to hire any and as many American Eagle pilots as it wishes, so the question is why is it necessary to compel American Airlines to hire American Eagle pilots through an Arbitrated 4 Party Agreement. The answer is very simple – American Airlines and the Allied Pilots Association do not wish to hire American Eagle pilots. Good-bye to the 824 Agreement in a bankruptcy.

In 1997 every American Eagle pilot was promised that they would be at American Airlines in 5 years. Today, 15 years later, 240 American Eagle pilots with AA seniority numbers are still withheld at American Eagle Airlines.

ALPA has already agreed to the concessionary agreement and the 8-year extension. The pilot ratification vote on the concessionary agreement will be a scam just as the Scope Letter of Agreement vote was a scam. In the Scope Letter of Agreement vote the “ballot box stuffing” with “yes votes” by ALPA would have made a Third World dictator blush with embarrassment. If you do not believe the AEPA and you have the time and a stiff libation, go to TWAPilot and you will be surprised what deceit ALPAengaged in to hide its purposeful failure to represent the TWA pilots in the seniority list integration negotiations with the APA after AA acquired TWA. It does not matter if TWA was bankrupt, about to go bankrupt or would have gone bankrupt, ALPA was legally required to represent the TWA pilots in exchange for sucking dues dollars from the TWA pilot’s paychecks. ALPA did not represent the TWA pilots and then tried to hide its malfeasance by destroying computers, hard drives, dvd’s and boxes of documents and that is why a jury will shortly consider a $1.2 billion damages award against ALPA.

American Eagle pilots should not allow themselves to be the last pilot group undermined by ALPA.

Every American Eagle Airlines’ pilot who embraced the ALPA dogma of “2013 … are you ready?” (see the ALPA Eagle MEC webpage under the “Talking Points” tab or the Back Page of this website) and who stuck a 2013 sticker on their flight bag should think long and hard before jumping on the ALPA U-TURN Bandwagon.
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Old 11-17-2011, 10:37 PM
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The new contract sucks..... I havent heard one pilot I have flown with say they will vote yes
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Old 11-18-2011, 12:53 AM
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yet everyone i talk to says they are, and most of the crew room banter seems in favor....also i do not go to dallas
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:05 AM
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The thing is AMR has never done anything just to be nice and make friends with labor. It does what is in its best financial interest. If its interest is to park 50 airplanes it would have done it already,and without asking the pilots first if its ok. The is nothing stopping them from doing it. They have a plan which is secret and not in our best financial interest. They want us to sign off on a section 6 end-around, and then will probably unveil the plan for E175 outside flying, etc (just an example).
The entire reasoning we are given for approving the TA is: take this deal or else... It is a very classic tactic, but it doesnt make sense given the reasoning above. If it was cheaper to outsource the planes or park them, it would be done already. Don't buy in to the threat.
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Old 11-18-2011, 06:22 AM
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It's how they roll. Article about Arpey’s MBA thesis and AA’s Business model | Local 565
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Wingtips
yet everyone i talk to says they are, and most of the crew room banter seems in favor....also i do not go to dallas
Yea if you sit around and talk to the Union guys.....Dan Garton is not to be trusted after reading his paper to the government.... If you have any friends that are lawyers have them read the proposal ....Never flown out of Dallas ---ORD based
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