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Old 11-18-2011, 06:14 PM   #21  
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your assuming many things, one that the economy does not improve, two that this new eagle does not win a bid for flying anywhere, three that AMR does not reach some sort of agreement for more hoed out flying to regionals, and four that AMR bids out all this new flying to another company besides Eagle, because they can only park so many planes before needing to replace that parked flying with a new plane.

Like I said, I am not a union guy, I am not even sure how I will vote, I am just sayin from a COMMON SENSE standpoint...
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Old 11-18-2011, 06:52 PM   #22  
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The furloughing would be the same amount in either case. They will be used as FTDT recall fill ins. Why, because you will have 50 airplanes parked between 2014-2016 and all the ATR's between 2012-2013.

Roughly 75 airplanes, 10 pilots per plane thats 750 pilots. 240 have AA numbers, 70% will go, leaving you 70 from the 240. 750-240=510,510+70=580. 580 excess pilots, unless other majors start hiring, no pref hire will be at AA short of 5 years from 2012.

Recalls at AA will only continue to maybe to let the numbered flow pilots who elect to go to AA, leave. The rest are excess.
Do you understand that AMR can bring in new ATRs over night at Eagle. The -600 only required a day of difference training, just like we do now with the 212 & 212A. Odds are AMR will buy new ATRs, the aircraft is to economical and the capabilities cannot be matched by any aircraft out there. And actually, AMR is increasing the ATR flying out of Dallas.
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Old 11-18-2011, 09:24 PM   #23  
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AMR can increase the fleet anytime it desires to, it also can replace aircraft as it see fit to do so now without this TA which is concessionary. Unless AMR has a place holder for aircraft deliveries, there are non scheduled for delivery at AE. The 600 would be a great airplane, more updated efis system than the EMB and CRJ NG.

The ATR's that we have will require great expense at the heavy check and are scheduled to be retired starting 2012-2013. Increase in flying is always great news, but just like there hiring practice at AMR, they hire til they furlough.
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Old 11-18-2011, 10:28 PM   #24  
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your assuming many things, one that the economy does not improve, two that this new eagle does not win a bid for flying anywhere, three that AMR does not reach some sort of agreement for more hoed out flying to regionals, and four that AMR bids out all this new flying to another company besides Eagle, because they can only park so many planes before needing to replace that parked flying with a new plane.

Like I said, I am not a union guy, I am not even sure how I will vote, I am just sayin from a COMMON SENSE standpoint...
You said your not planing on staying at the regionals....Why would you vote for a contract (8) years which is a consession.. especially with a pilot shortage looming in the next year or two? Thats 8 years were we cant negotiate a better contract... Plus they can cut the pay in 2014 across the board....Dan Garton even admits there is a pilot shortage looming and that its very hard to find pilots.... The TA doesnt talk about A. the future B. New aircraft C. Creating a better product..... They are not going to have new ATR's overnight...AA pilots have the final say about everything...why do you think they are holding off on the divesture till the AA pilots have a TA.....This TA is just to keep us in check..holding a AA carrot in front of us to keep us from leaving eagle when other airlines start hiring.

I fly mostly with senior capts and they have all said this TA wont effect us, but it will screw all you new guys...they have all said they will vote no just so karma doesnt come back to bite them in the butt.
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Old 11-19-2011, 04:39 AM   #25  
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Do you understand that AMR can bring in new ATRs over night at Eagle. The -600 only required a day of difference training, just like we do now with the 212 & 212A. Odds are AMR will buy new ATRs, the aircraft is to economical and the capabilities cannot be matched by any aircraft out there. And actually, AMR is increasing the ATR flying out of Dallas.
Uh, there will be a new turbo-prop. It's gonna be painted the same and say "operated by Colgan Airlines" that nice new shiny Q-400.
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Old 11-19-2011, 02:14 PM   #26  
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subrat-well said. the economy is not going to do well next year. aa requires to much control of another company to feed its operations and does not guarantee to make up those loses. Those who have not decide as they say but will go to AA will vote yes, because they are looking out for themselves. Why, because they get the loan, which will disappear quickly with in 3 months of spinoff.

I just tell them, can you live with this agreement for 10 years if you dont leave? The dumbest looks I have ever seen when they are asked that. They come up with wishfully scenarios to justify, like retirements, new aircraft and growth at AA. Blinders on as always. AA will have a 15% reduction in staffing requirements due to change in work rules, the new aircraft and the average 3-4 % annually shrinkage at AA. Lets not forget they wont get the A/B fund unless they have a number today at AA.

So they may vote yes here and leave but karma will bite them over there and they will be worse off than before.
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Old 11-19-2011, 02:32 PM   #27  
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Uh, there will be a new turbo-prop. It's gonna be painted the same and say "operated by Colgan Airlines" that nice new shiny Q-400.
I doubt this, more likely would either be some sort of new feed, or getting them at Eagle. The option to have someone else fly this stuff for Eagle has been there for years, AMR has actually given less feed out, not more.
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Old 11-19-2011, 04:10 PM   #28  
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The new contract sucks..... I havent heard one pilot I have flown with say they will vote yes
I did...that's actually all what he was talking for 4 days. I just ignored all the facts he said.

"this is for job preservation, vote yes, blah blah blah"

In my case I will vote NO, just because they are screwing all the FOs. Captains get payraise, FOs gets nothing...just 2.1% of IAI... in my case just 74cents per hour.
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Old 11-19-2011, 05:41 PM   #29  
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Uh, there will be a new turbo-prop. It's gonna be painted the same and say "operated by Colgan Airlines" that nice new shiny Q-400.
The Q400 doesn't have the cargo room to do most of the ATR routes that are flown out of DFW (yea if it fits it will carry). The military bags are a bit heavy! Also the Q utilizes allot more fuel than the ATR. It doesn't matter how cheap Colgan can fly the Q, the ATR is cheaper to operate. The ATR cruses @ roughly 1,500 lbs per hr. The Q probably burns that per side!
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Old 11-19-2011, 05:44 PM   #30  
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I doubt this, more likely would either be some sort of new feed, or getting them at Eagle. The option to have someone else fly this stuff for Eagle has been there for years, AMR has actually given less feed out, not more.
Exactly, right now AMR can give more flying to Chititaco, RAH is parking 145, AMR can get them to fly it for them, but the truth of the matter is that no one whats to do the AMR 50 seater feed for the price AMR wants to pay.
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