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Originally Posted by FangsF15
(Post 4031614)
This is an incredibly biased and willfully ignorant take.
You know exactly what was meant by wild predictions of, “furloughs!!” Trying to tie an elderly patient already on double life support to ‘furloughs’ to justify your worldview on the issue seriously lacks credibility. |
Originally Posted by word302
(Post 4031707)
Really? Were people really running around screaming the end is nigh? Spirit would still be operating today if it weren't for the current state in the ME, which is 100% self-inflicted by the current administration.
Originally Posted by MaxQ
(Post 4031483)
(I should know better than to engage with you, but humans are more emotional than wise)
"Furloughs or no furloughs". While technically having ones employer cease operation isn't a furlough, it certainly achieves the same result. The number of people at Spirit was around 17,000, was it not? (And probably thousands more to come as the Spirit shutdown ripples through its vendors) It is actually worse than a furlough. All vacation accrued gone. All accrued sick leave, gone. All accrued seniority, gone., So, for those who predicted furloughs, I would say they pretty much called it right. Blaming “the current administration” is just a little simplistic. |
Originally Posted by Excargodog
(Post 4031713)
I was at Spirit. I bailed when the court judgement went against the merger - on the advice of the senior CAs I was flying with. I understand and sympathize very much with those who had more seniority there than I did and opted to stay. They had more to lose starting over than I did. But NK went into bankruptcy TWICE in less than a year BEFORE the war started. And engine issues they couldn’t promptly address due to the engine manufacturers having used defective supply chains during COVID. Blaming this on Iran in the face of increased competition from the legacies, engine manufacturer problems, serious miscalculation by management and the DOJ as to its viability absent a merger leaves plenty of blame to spread around not involving anything having to do with foreign policy decisions one may or may not agree with.
Blaming “the current administration” is just a little simplistic. But it was the immediate and proximate cause. It doesn't have to be even "blaming the administration". It was in response to Vax saying the predictions of furloughs hadn't come to pass. Well, they now have. It was the proverbial straw and it is pedantic spin to try and say that "well they don't count" because they were already sick. I worked for one of the 3 majors that closed their doors in Nov. 1991. It is quite likely that none of them would have been in business by the end of 1992. But it is an empirical fact that the first gulf war was the reason that the shut down occurred in Nov '91. It is disingenuous to say elsewise. |
Originally Posted by MaxQ
(Post 4031717)
You are correct Cargo.
But it was the immediate and proximate cause. It doesn't have to be even "blaming the administration". It was in response to Vax saying the predictions of furloughs hadn't come to pass. Well, they now have. It was the proverbial straw and it is pedantic spin to try and say that "well they don't count" because they were already sick. I worked for one of the 3 majors that closed their doors in Nov. 1991. It is quite likely that none of them would have been in business by the end of 1992. But it is an empirical fact that the first gulf war was the reason that the shut down occurred in Nov '91. It is disingenuous to say elsewise. They liquidated simply because they ran out of cash. This was going to happen whether gas prices went up or not. Their business model was not sustainable without an influx of cash every few months. They knew that and tried to merge with another airline...... until Biden foolishly put a stop to that under some misguided anti-competitive belief. How well is that working out now? You also realize that there have been furloughs over the past few years even when other airlines were hiring right? In addition to Spirit, Avelo and Omni furlough ted. I am sure there were a few others. This was before the price increase. The point the other posters are making is we all knew what you meant with your ridiculous original prediction, we would see furloughs industry wide. Well that hasn't happened yet. Sorry not sorry |
Originally Posted by Judge Smails
(Post 4031383)
Whatever. There’s different ways to argue this. The very simple point is the cost of filling up has risen substantially as a direct result of our Presidents unilateral actions.
Which President? USA or Iran? . |
Originally Posted by Profane Kahuna
(Post 4031738)
Which President? USA or Iran?
. Soooo..... |
Originally Posted by Excargodog
(Post 4031713)
I was at Spirit. I bailed when the court judgement went against the merger - on the advice of the senior CAs I was flying with. I understand and sympathize very much with those who had more seniority there than I did and opted to stay. They had more to lose starting over than I did. But NK went into bankruptcy TWICE in less than a year BEFORE the war started. And engine issues they couldn’t promptly address due to the engine manufacturers having used defective supply chains during COVID. Blaming this on Iran in the face of increased competition from the legacies, engine manufacturer problems, serious miscalculation by management and the DOJ as to its viability absent a merger leaves plenty of blame to spread around not involving anything having to do with foreign policy decisions one may or may not agree with.
Blaming “the current administration” is just a little simplistic. Do I blame the current administration for all of Spirit’s problems? No Do I think fuel costs sealed their fate this week? Yes Do I think Spirit management has been failing at their jobs for almost 1/2 a decade now? Also yes. Do I think Spirit is the only carrier that won’t survive this? No. Pretty simple. |
Originally Posted by MaxQ
(Post 4031742)
Iran's HMFIC was killed on day one.
Soooo..... “Portraying Iran as a threat is neither consistent with historical reality nor with present-day observable facts,” he wrote. “Such a perception is the product of political and economic whims of the powerful—the need to manufacture an enemy in order to justify pressure, maintain military dominance, sustain the arms industry, and control strategic markets. In such an environment, if a threat does not exist, it is invented.” |
Originally Posted by METO Guido
(Post 4031748)
Iranian President Masoud Pezeshkian;
^^^strokemaster believes that. I do not. |
Originally Posted by DeltaboundRedux
(Post 4031701)
One could suggest that Spirit was the first and the ultimate furlough.
Then again, the Warren Buffett quip about "It’s only when the tide goes out that you discover who’s been swimming naked” comes to mind. |
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