NWA - Delta list
12-09-2008, 04:51 AM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Spinal Tap Drummer
Posts: 122
Constructing the Integrated System Seniority List.
The ISSL has been constructed from the pre-merger Delta and pre-merger
Northwest pilot seniority lists in effect on November 1, 2008, as provided to the Panel
by the parties, in the manner set forth below. The relative position of each pilot on the
pre-merger lists remained unchanged on the ISSL.
1. All pilots on long-term sick leave (12 months or longer) were removed
from the pre-merger lists.
2. The 274 oldest Northwest pilots were removed from the pre-merger list.
3. The first 3045 positions on the ISSL were filled with the first 1961 Delta
pilots and 1084 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
1961:1084 beginning with a Delta pilot.
4. The next 2433 positions on the ISSL were filled with the next 1313 Delta
pilots and 1120 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
1313:1120 beginning with a Delta pilot.
5. The next 3932 positions on the ISSL were filled with the next 2580 Delta
pilots and 1352 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
2580:1352 beginning with a Delta pilot.
6. The ISSL was completed with Delta and Northwest pilots remaining on the
pre-merger lists in a ratio of 1314:957 Delta to Northwest pilots beginning
with a Delta pilot until both pre-merger lists are exhausted subject to
paragraph 7, below.
7. All pilots with dates of hire after April 14, 2008, were placed at the bottom
of the ISSL in order of date of hire.
8. The Northwest pilots pulled in paragraph 2. were inserted directly above
the next junior Northwest pilot.
The ISSL has been constructed from the pre-merger Delta and pre-merger
Northwest pilot seniority lists in effect on November 1, 2008, as provided to the Panel
by the parties, in the manner set forth below. The relative position of each pilot on the
pre-merger lists remained unchanged on the ISSL.
1. All pilots on long-term sick leave (12 months or longer) were removed
from the pre-merger lists.
2. The 274 oldest Northwest pilots were removed from the pre-merger list.
3. The first 3045 positions on the ISSL were filled with the first 1961 Delta
pilots and 1084 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
1961:1084 beginning with a Delta pilot.
4. The next 2433 positions on the ISSL were filled with the next 1313 Delta
pilots and 1120 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
1313:1120 beginning with a Delta pilot.
5. The next 3932 positions on the ISSL were filled with the next 2580 Delta
pilots and 1352 Northwest pilots on the pre-merger lists in a ratio of
2580:1352 beginning with a Delta pilot.
6. The ISSL was completed with Delta and Northwest pilots remaining on the
pre-merger lists in a ratio of 1314:957 Delta to Northwest pilots beginning
with a Delta pilot until both pre-merger lists are exhausted subject to
paragraph 7, below.
7. All pilots with dates of hire after April 14, 2008, were placed at the bottom
of the ISSL in order of date of hire.
8. The Northwest pilots pulled in paragraph 2. were inserted directly above
the next junior Northwest pilot.
The Pilots of Northwest Airlines, Inc.
and The Pilots of Delta Air Lines, Inc.
Page 30 of 32
and The Pilots of Delta Air Lines, Inc.
Page 30 of 32
9. The pilots on long-term sick leave pulled in paragraph 1. were inserted
directly above the next junior pilot on his/her respective pre-merger list.
Finally, as an integral part of the ISSL we have fashioned Conditions and Restrictions that are incorporated as this Board’s Award .
directly above the next junior pilot on his/her respective pre-merger list.
Finally, as an integral part of the ISSL we have fashioned Conditions and Restrictions that are incorporated as this Board’s Award .
AWARD
A. The Integrated System Seniority List (ISSL) for the pilots at Delta Airlines shall be the List attached to this Award as Exhibit A.
B. Conditions and Restrictions
1. These conditions and restrictions are an integral part of the ISSL and shall remain in full force and effect until their expiration by their terms.
2. Pilots hired after April 14, 2008, shall be junior to all pilots on the ISSL
and shall be listed in order of date of hire consistent with the Joint
Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA.).
3. Neither the implementation of the ISSL nor the implementation or
expiration of a condition or restriction herein, in and of itself, shall cause
the displacement of any pilot from his or her then-current position
(including pilots who have been awarded positions but had not
commenced or completed training).
4. For the period of five (5) years beginning with the first bid period after the issuance of the Single Operating Certificate (SOC), no pre-merger
Northwest pilot may be awarded or displaced to a vacancy on a B777
aircraft or category and no pre-merger Delta pilot may be awarded or
displaced to a B787 or B747 vacancy.
5. Should the merged company take delivery of any aircraft which is/are a
replacement of any aircraft covered by Paragraph 4., the captain positions
and, as applicable, the first officer positions on each such replacement
B. Conditions and Restrictions
1. These conditions and restrictions are an integral part of the ISSL and shall remain in full force and effect until their expiration by their terms.
2. Pilots hired after April 14, 2008, shall be junior to all pilots on the ISSL
and shall be listed in order of date of hire consistent with the Joint
Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA.).
3. Neither the implementation of the ISSL nor the implementation or
expiration of a condition or restriction herein, in and of itself, shall cause
the displacement of any pilot from his or her then-current position
(including pilots who have been awarded positions but had not
commenced or completed training).
4. For the period of five (5) years beginning with the first bid period after the issuance of the Single Operating Certificate (SOC), no pre-merger
Northwest pilot may be awarded or displaced to a vacancy on a B777
aircraft or category and no pre-merger Delta pilot may be awarded or
displaced to a B787 or B747 vacancy.
5. Should the merged company take delivery of any aircraft which is/are a
replacement of any aircraft covered by Paragraph 4., the captain positions
and, as applicable, the first officer positions on each such replacement
The Pilots of Northwest Airlines, Inc. and The Pilots of Delta Air Lines, Inc.
aircraft will be allocated in accordance with the Paragraph 4. restrictions
on the type it is replacing.
6. Paragraph 4. shall expire on the fifth (5th) anniversary of the SOC. Any
bid awards or displacements effective after that date will not be subject to this restriction.
7. If there are insufficient bidders from one pre-merger pilot group for a
posted or contingent vacancy on one side of the fence during the period
covered by Paragraph 4., unfilled vacancies may be filled by pilots from the other pre-merger airline.
8. A pilot awarded a position (via an AE, MD or VD) to a category as a result of insufficient bidders will, for the purposes of processing future
displacements in accordance with Section 22 F. of the JCBA, be considered as junior to all pilots from the pre-merger pilot group that was entitled to that category.
9. From November 1, 2008, until the first bid period following issuance of
the SOC, any furloughs that are the result of the reduction in flying in the
pre-merger aircraft contained in each airline's pre-merger fleet shall be
borne by the pilots from that pre-merger airline regardless of their system
seniority; provided, however, that any furloughs resulting from such
reduction in B757 shall be shared on a 1:1 basis.
10. In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy and Paragraph 7. of the Process Agreement, representatives of the pre-merger Delta MEC and pre-merger Northwest MEC will adopt a simple process for resolving questions
concerning the interpretation or application of the ISSL by this Award.
11. In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy and Paragraphs 7. and 9. of the Process Agreement, this Arbitration Board shall retain jurisdiction to
resolve any unresolved disputes between the pre-merger pilot groups as to the terms of the Dispute Resolution Process and/or the interpretation or application of this Award.
on the type it is replacing.
6. Paragraph 4. shall expire on the fifth (5th) anniversary of the SOC. Any
bid awards or displacements effective after that date will not be subject to this restriction.
7. If there are insufficient bidders from one pre-merger pilot group for a
posted or contingent vacancy on one side of the fence during the period
covered by Paragraph 4., unfilled vacancies may be filled by pilots from the other pre-merger airline.
8. A pilot awarded a position (via an AE, MD or VD) to a category as a result of insufficient bidders will, for the purposes of processing future
displacements in accordance with Section 22 F. of the JCBA, be considered as junior to all pilots from the pre-merger pilot group that was entitled to that category.
9. From November 1, 2008, until the first bid period following issuance of
the SOC, any furloughs that are the result of the reduction in flying in the
pre-merger aircraft contained in each airline's pre-merger fleet shall be
borne by the pilots from that pre-merger airline regardless of their system
seniority; provided, however, that any furloughs resulting from such
reduction in B757 shall be shared on a 1:1 basis.
10. In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy and Paragraph 7. of the Process Agreement, representatives of the pre-merger Delta MEC and pre-merger Northwest MEC will adopt a simple process for resolving questions
concerning the interpretation or application of the ISSL by this Award.
11. In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy and Paragraphs 7. and 9. of the Process Agreement, this Arbitration Board shall retain jurisdiction to
resolve any unresolved disputes between the pre-merger pilot groups as to the terms of the Dispute Resolution Process and/or the interpretation or application of this Award.
12-09-2008, 04:54 AM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Spinal Tap Drummer
Posts: 122
The last 48 pilots are DAL. An NWA pilot hired in Sept 01 is paired next to DAL pilots with Jan 08 hire dates. From top to bottom it pretty much maintains a pilot's % in seniority pre vs. post merger (e.g., NWA pilot # 653/5173 is now # 1433/12434, or 87% pre vs. 88% post merger).
12-09-2008, 05:11 AM
#5
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: The Beginnings
Posts: 1,317
I'm reminded of a poem about kids going to their first day of school: "All of us face together, what we also face alone." 
Too bad about the 5 year fences. Could be worse though. It's short enough so that we should start thinking and acting like a collective single group when our next contract negotiations start again in a couple of years.
Furloughs (if necessary) will be absorbed by the side of the carrier (NWA v DAL) that they're needed, not strict seniority order (except for 757, which will be 1 for 1). Unfortunate, that. Could lead to some pretty hard feelings if one side gets hit with lots of aircraft retirements. Unite, baby, don't divide . .
Too bad about the 5 year fences. Could be worse though. It's short enough so that we should start thinking and acting like a collective single group when our next contract negotiations start again in a couple of years.
Furloughs (if necessary) will be absorbed by the side of the carrier (NWA v DAL) that they're needed, not strict seniority order (except for 757, which will be 1 for 1). Unfortunate, that. Could lead to some pretty hard feelings if one side gets hit with lots of aircraft retirements. Unite, baby, don't divide . .
12-09-2008, 05:16 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 973
Originally Posted by deltabound
Furloughs (if necessary) will be absorbed by the side of the carrier (NWA v DAL) that they're needed, not strict seniority order (except for 757, which will be 1 for 1). Unfortunate, that. Could lead to some pretty hard feelings if one side gets hit with lots of aircraft retirements. Unite, baby, don't divide . .
12-09-2008, 05:23 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Position: 737 F/O
Posts: 500
Originally Posted by Schwartz
The last 48 pilots are DAL. An NWA pilot hired in Sept 01 is paired next to DAL pilots with Jan 08 hire dates. From top to bottom it pretty much maintains a pilot's % in seniority pre vs. post merger (e.g., NWA pilot # 653/5173 is now # 1433/12434, or 87% pre vs. 88% post merger).
12-09-2008, 05:37 AM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 7ER B
Posts: 145
I totally agree that we should start acting like the most powerful pilot group in the world. Basically, there is so much money tied up in this airline, we should now be able to begin to get back what this profession once had.
In conjunction, with oil at the prices that it is at, we should be able to argue that the 5 billion profit Bastain talked about should make furloughs a non starter.
If one side needs to furlough, JUST FOR EXAMPLE.... IF say the -9's or classic 74's take a hit and if premerger Delta needs to hire, I suggest that we offer those pilots jobs at the bottom of the Delta list until the SOC is in place and they can then return to their proper place on the combined list. This could help any strange surges in the system until the SOC is in place.
Slinky
In conjunction, with oil at the prices that it is at, we should be able to argue that the 5 billion profit Bastain talked about should make furloughs a non starter.
If one side needs to furlough, JUST FOR EXAMPLE.... IF say the -9's or classic 74's take a hit and if premerger Delta needs to hire, I suggest that we offer those pilots jobs at the bottom of the Delta list until the SOC is in place and they can then return to their proper place on the combined list. This could help any strange surges in the system until the SOC is in place.
Slinky
12-09-2008, 05:38 AM
#9
New Hire
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: 767 f/o
Posts: 2
Well, as a Delta pilot the results are interesting. I really looks like it favored Delta big time in fairness and let NW get a foot in the door.
Just for info, I was 38.335% up from the bottom at the Delta list and moved up to 38.625% on the combined list. I did not get the big pay raise NW did but and we were able to fence our 777 from NW pilots for 5 years.
For now I did ok and as a whole I think the Delta pilots were treated well. The NW pilots did not all get put at the bottom because the Delta pilots hired after 14 apr 08 on the bottom of the list. They did not get their DOH. They got a small amount of pull and plug.
Again, I know everyone won't be happy among the Delta pilots but it came out more in our favor in a major way which compensates the lack of the pay increase.
As it settles in things will emerge but wee will see.
Cheers
Just for info, I was 38.335% up from the bottom at the Delta list and moved up to 38.625% on the combined list. I did not get the big pay raise NW did but and we were able to fence our 777 from NW pilots for 5 years.
For now I did ok and as a whole I think the Delta pilots were treated well. The NW pilots did not all get put at the bottom because the Delta pilots hired after 14 apr 08 on the bottom of the list. They did not get their DOH. They got a small amount of pull and plug.
Again, I know everyone won't be happy among the Delta pilots but it came out more in our favor in a major way which compensates the lack of the pay increase.
As it settles in things will emerge but wee will see.
Cheers
12-09-2008, 05:54 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 405
Originally Posted by flaps 9
Too bad USAir didn't understand this concept
I'm sure the NWA guys are getting a whole bunch of 'understanding'.
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