Can we please REGULATE AVIATION once again ?
03-04-2009 | 06:03 AM
#101
Self Employed.
Joined: May 2005
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From: Corporate Pilot
Market price
You're mistaken on the term "fair market price" with a temporarily agreeable price.
When one side of a collectively bargained contract has all the information, government assistance and court leverage, wages can be dictated and are not necessarily fair. Now, give the labor groups more leverage with an admended RLA and we'll get a little closer to fair.
When one side of a collectively bargained contract has all the information, government assistance and court leverage, wages can be dictated and are not necessarily fair. Now, give the labor groups more leverage with an admended RLA and we'll get a little closer to fair.
The union has its idea of a fair wage and the real world has another. Since deregulation wages have been falling to match what the real street value is. At best the unions are organizing the retreat.
An amended RLA might accomplish a short term victory for a while however the artificially inflated wages will hasten the collapse of the legacy airlines. Companies have to be competitive to remain in business.
Skyhigh
03-04-2009 | 06:17 AM
#102
Self Employed.
Joined: May 2005
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From: Corporate Pilot
Compensation
Fatty,
I wasn't trying to denegrate truck driving, the point that struck me was the training required compared to the training, time and money investment, and sacrifices that pilots make to get to that first airline gig, and the compensation a pilot can expect these days. And thanks for the info about truck driving, I had heard there was good money in it. I just still have this impression, (and call me egomaniacal), that for the sheer responsibility we assume (passengers' lives), risk (airplanes do crash), and skill required (contrary to what some say here, I still don't believe that your average joe could be a competent airline pilot), that airline pilot pay should be head and shoulders above truck driver pay, even starting. And sorry for the run-on...
I wasn't trying to denegrate truck driving, the point that struck me was the training required compared to the training, time and money investment, and sacrifices that pilots make to get to that first airline gig, and the compensation a pilot can expect these days. And thanks for the info about truck driving, I had heard there was good money in it. I just still have this impression, (and call me egomaniacal), that for the sheer responsibility we assume (passengers' lives), risk (airplanes do crash), and skill required (contrary to what some say here, I still don't believe that your average joe could be a competent airline pilot), that airline pilot pay should be head and shoulders above truck driver pay, even starting. And sorry for the run-on...
This thread is timely and ironic. Just yesterday I was offered a truck driving job by a business acquaintance. The wages and working conditions I was offered as a new truck driver are better than what most regional airline captains get. Not only would the company would pay for my training I would be home every night and would get total control over my schedule.
I was told years ago by a former aviation employer that "pilots are a dime a dozen". Yesterday I was told by my business acquaintance that "intelligent responsible people who can test clean of drugs are hard to come by in the trades". I have value as a truck driver but none as a pilot.
SKyhigh
03-04-2009 | 03:44 PM
#106
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 216
Likes: 0
From: ????????????????
To make the job more sound with better pay just get rid of as many RJs as possible. Better to protect the job you are going to have some day than the job you don't want forever. I spent 6 years at a regional waiting to get to the job I wanted. The whole while alpa told me that more RJ's was better for me. Less RJs would have gotten me to my final company sooner. As for all the socialism that goes with regulation. read a history book kid. If US AIrWAYS would have been allowed to tank than the other airlines would be in better shape.
03-04-2009 | 09:32 PM
#107
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People felt that TWA and Pan Am were the greatest airlines ever because during regulation, the only choice a pax had to make was which airline had better customer service, airlines fought for that. Thats what seperated who made money and who didnt.Flight attendants weren't texting, and pilots weren't complaining about wearing hats.
If we regfulated for a set amount of time maybe 5-10 years, we would see a huge boost in sold seats.We need to regulate and we need to do it now!
If we regfulated for a set amount of time maybe 5-10 years, we would see a huge boost in sold seats.We need to regulate and we need to do it now!
03-05-2009 | 02:58 AM
#108
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 216
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From: ????????????????
People felt that TWA and Pan Am were the greatest airlines ever because during regulation, the only choice a pax had to make was which airline had better customer service, airlines fought for that. Thats what seperated who made money and who didnt.Flight attendants weren't texting, and pilots weren't complaining about wearing hats.
If we regfulated for a set amount of time maybe 5-10 years, we would see a huge boost in sold seats.We need to regulate and we need to do it now!
If we regfulated for a set amount of time maybe 5-10 years, we would see a huge boost in sold seats.We need to regulate and we need to do it now!
03-05-2009 | 03:15 AM
#109
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 287
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From: standing-by
Ok guys this is what I am talking about,
WHY AS A PILOT GROUP WE ARE WORRYING ABOUT THE PUBLIC?
1- Regulate airlines means more money for the airline it self, steady jobs for Us pilots (I don't see medical procedures getting cheaper at hospital or dental offices)
2- So Amtrak sucks in America but you know what the Amtrak employee is not getting furlough every year, is not getting a regional Amtrak train to take his job a way, no Amtrak no ride. No main line pilots to flight guess what here comes a new pilot that will fly for $ 18.00 in hour so he or she can get 1000 golden hours of pic.
3- We are waiting for the economy to pick up, For what? so we can get laid off again thats very nice.
4- WHO CARES ABOUT THE PASSENGERS DO YOU THINK PASSENGERS GET ABOUT YOU OR YOUR FAMILY AHHH GUESS WHAT NO , F...K THE PASSENGERS. WE NEED TO STAND UP FOR ONCE AND GET THIS IDEA TO THE CONGRESS SOME HOW.
WHY AS A PILOT GROUP WE ARE WORRYING ABOUT THE PUBLIC?
1- Regulate airlines means more money for the airline it self, steady jobs for Us pilots (I don't see medical procedures getting cheaper at hospital or dental offices)
2- So Amtrak sucks in America but you know what the Amtrak employee is not getting furlough every year, is not getting a regional Amtrak train to take his job a way, no Amtrak no ride. No main line pilots to flight guess what here comes a new pilot that will fly for $ 18.00 in hour so he or she can get 1000 golden hours of pic.
3- We are waiting for the economy to pick up, For what? so we can get laid off again thats very nice.
4- WHO CARES ABOUT THE PASSENGERS DO YOU THINK PASSENGERS GET ABOUT YOU OR YOUR FAMILY AHHH GUESS WHAT NO , F...K THE PASSENGERS. WE NEED TO STAND UP FOR ONCE AND GET THIS IDEA TO THE CONGRESS SOME HOW.
03-05-2009 | 03:18 AM
#110
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 287
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From: standing-by
These Corrupt Officials and Mangers are a by product of our federal government. If you live in a neighborhood of thieves, don't be surprised to find your things stolen after leaving your door wide open.
In an ideal world, you could probably expect that Big Industry/Corporation would be ethically run, but we don't live in that world.
America is run by Corporation, and many hard working Americans, but you can't solely blame Big Corporation.
Don't get me wrong these Dirty CEOs, Hedge Fund Managers, Speculators, Brokers, and Investment Firms are garbage, but we created the atmosphere that allowed these individuals to exploit the system. It's to our federal government to change the system so these people can't further harm our economy.
Problem is, too many government officials have been in bed with these people for a VERY long time.
Nobody likes to bite the hand that feeds them, and as long Corrupt Official weren't growing hungry for money or power, no one was going to step up and enforce the fiance sector.
In an ideal world, you could probably expect that Big Industry/Corporation would be ethically run, but we don't live in that world.
America is run by Corporation, and many hard working Americans, but you can't solely blame Big Corporation.
Don't get me wrong these Dirty CEOs, Hedge Fund Managers, Speculators, Brokers, and Investment Firms are garbage, but we created the atmosphere that allowed these individuals to exploit the system. It's to our federal government to change the system so these people can't further harm our economy.
Problem is, too many government officials have been in bed with these people for a VERY long time.
Nobody likes to bite the hand that feeds them, and as long Corrupt Official weren't growing hungry for money or power, no one was going to step up and enforce the fiance sector.
Last edited by SayAgain; 03-05-2009 at 01:22 PM. Reason: spelling
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