RAH buying Midwest
06-24-2009, 01:24 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by STILL GROUNDED
The tide has changed in the seniority group as well, last contract was negotiated in 03, the majority of the senority list is junior to that meaning.
The usual way of doing things was for this kind of pilot to get on with a major and learn the industry from the veterans in the left seat. RAH pilots do not have this opportunity, nor even access to that kind of experience (Teamsters is not like ALPA). Many of Teamster's best airlines left already (NetJets, UPS, etc), though World, ABEX, and Atlas are all there, and the leadership of 747 was just expelled for corruption.
The majority of the seniority list has less than 6 years, nobody there has any experience with this kind of operation, Non-ETOP's A319's can make Hawaii (though, in your defense, Spirit operates FLL-LIM, which is 60 NM's longer than LAX-HNL, and used to operate LAX-LIM, which is almost 1400 NM's further - NK guys, can you fly full on this route?), not much airline experience, local leadership ousted . . . I understand not prejudging the efforts of RAH's pilots and the Teamsters, but you certainly understand that the fundamentals suggest a cause for concern, no?
06-24-2009, 01:28 PM
#43
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Position: SkyWest Capt.
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Originally Posted by Sniper
So, the median Republic pilot has less than 6 years on property (that's all the FO's and many of the CA's), and likely less than 10 years total flying experience.
The usual way of doing things was for this kind of pilot to get on with a major and learn the industry from the veterans in the left seat. RAH pilots do not have this opportunity, nor even access to that kind of experience (Teamsters is not like ALPA). Many of Teamster's best airlines left already (NetJets, UPS, etc), though World, ABEX, and Atlas are all there, and the leadership of 747 was just expelled for corruption.
The majority of the seniority list has less than 6 years, nobody there has any experience with this kind of operation, Non-ETOP's A319's can make Hawaii (though, in your defense, Spirit operates FLL-LIM, which is 60 NM's longer than LAX-HNL, and used to operate LAX-LIM, which is almost 1400 NM's further - NK guys, can you fly full on this route?), not much airline experience, local leadership ousted . . . I understand not prejudging the efforts of RAH's pilots and the Teamsters, but you certainly understand that the fundamentals suggest a cause for concern, no?
The usual way of doing things was for this kind of pilot to get on with a major and learn the industry from the veterans in the left seat. RAH pilots do not have this opportunity, nor even access to that kind of experience (Teamsters is not like ALPA). Many of Teamster's best airlines left already (NetJets, UPS, etc), though World, ABEX, and Atlas are all there, and the leadership of 747 was just expelled for corruption.
The majority of the seniority list has less than 6 years, nobody there has any experience with this kind of operation, Non-ETOP's A319's can make Hawaii (though, in your defense, Spirit operates FLL-LIM, which is 60 NM's longer than LAX-HNL, and used to operate LAX-LIM, which is almost 1400 NM's further - NK guys, can you fly full on this route?), not much airline experience, local leadership ousted . . . I understand not prejudging the efforts of RAH's pilots and the Teamsters, but you certainly understand that the fundamentals suggest a cause for concern, no?
06-24-2009, 01:30 PM
#44
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Posts: 798
Originally Posted by FlyingDawg
Seniority integration will follow the Allegheny Mohawk protocols, and the Republic pilots are already represented. I'm sure you already know for ALPA to come onto property would require a decertification vote for the already in place union. And just as a reminder ALPA was not interested in representing the Chautauqua pilots (now RAH pilots). Have they changed their mind?
What is the Allegheny Mohawk protocol for a REGIONAL merging with a NATIONAL aircraft.
O' Yes, I remember the protocol... fly for a REGIONAL to build the experience to get hired by a NATIONAL or MAJOR airline.
ps. What is "fair and equitable" for this type of merger?
06-24-2009, 01:31 PM
#45
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Originally Posted by xtreme
Fourth carrier.
Originally Posted by RAHPilot5
Rumor floating around headquarters that a 3rd airline is going to be bought.
06-24-2009, 01:32 PM
#46
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Originally Posted by MD80
What is the Allegheny Mohawk protocol for a REGIONAL merging with a NATIONAL aircraft.
O' Yes, I remember the protocol... fly for a REGIONAL to build the experience to get hired by a NATIONAL or MAJOR airline.
ps. What is "fair and equitable" for this type of merger?
O' Yes, I remember the protocol... fly for a REGIONAL to build the experience to get hired by a NATIONAL or MAJOR airline.
ps. What is "fair and equitable" for this type of merger?
06-24-2009, 01:34 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by JetJock16
But as for buying a third carrier, I don’t see any other Major’s out there who are looking for those kinds of handouts……………….well maybe Spirit.
Originally Posted by JetJock16
Isn't Spirit using A321's for their long haul?
06-24-2009, 02:04 PM
#48
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Originally Posted by Sniper
I doubt it. Spirit made more than twice as much $ this quarter as RAH.
I think BB might have biting off a little more than he can chew. Once his merger/seniority/labor contract battles gets into full swing as well as whatever issues arise with UAL, DAL and US over his purchases and movement toward stand-alone/direct competitor; he might start regretting his decisions.
Only time will tell. Until then best of luck to all, I’m on F9 and Midwest pilots’ side…………………….. and I’m glad I’m not involved.
Originally Posted by Sniper
Those things are pigs. LAX is about as far as they can get from the east coast. The 319 is Airbus's longest range NB.
06-24-2009, 02:15 PM
#49
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This will take some heat but in my mind the only fair seniority merger between two National/Majors and one regional is this: % based merger between F9 and Midwest including all furloughees and then staple the RAH pilots to the bottom. Then place a 5 year fence on top. Or Merge F9 and Midwest and keep RAH separate much like Alaska/Horizon.
IMO, Major airline pilots carry more career weight than the regional pilots do. I know the RAH pilots won’t like this but if it goes before an arbitrator you can guarantee that they will take that into account. Bottom line, no matter how you cut it is that the regionals are a stepping stone to the majors so no regional pilot should be spring boarded on top of those who have already done their time.
IMO, Major airline pilots carry more career weight than the regional pilots do. I know the RAH pilots won’t like this but if it goes before an arbitrator you can guarantee that they will take that into account. Bottom line, no matter how you cut it is that the regionals are a stepping stone to the majors so no regional pilot should be spring boarded on top of those who have already done their time.
06-24-2009, 02:31 PM
#50
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Originally Posted by JetJock16
. . . no regional pilot should be spring boarded on top of those who have already done their time.
Sig:
'ToiletDuck': I'm in favor of a TWA style integration [@ RAH for MidEx and Frontier]
Last edited by Sniper; 06-24-2009 at 02:32 PM. Reason: where's my signature?!
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