Why not start by asking them? Believe it or not you can call or write and speak with someone.

 

I guess my sarcasm didn't come off as intended. I was kidding. Nice font though

 

I have been an ALPA member and a FAPA member. Independent and national unions both have their pros and cons, but if I had a choice (hopefully there will be a representation drive soon at RAH) I would choose Independent in a heart beat.

 

I suppose dentists and doctors have elitist attitudes vs their community college graduate co-workers? If any other labor group had to bring HALF to the table to get their job that a pilot does than you might have a point.

 

Originally Posted by T Dawg
The elitist mentality of airline pilots vs. other LABOR groups is truly disgusting. If you two want to try to go it alone…..good luck, look what that has done for our industry.


I understand TDawg's point...and he's right.

We as pilots have always seen ourselves as "better than" other labor groups. Maybe it's the uniforms or that we fly planes. Yes, we have specalized licenses.

Let's cut to the chase. We move one of two things. People (passenger carriers) or commodities (cargo). So do bus drivers and truckers.

Yes, that's simplistic and offends. But put yourself in the seat of management for a minute. What do they call FA's? Glorified sky waitresses. They think of us the same way. Labor that produces a product (a safe flight) that moves a commodity (people or boxes) and generates revenue for the company, profit for the shareholders and bonuses for them...IF they can drive down the cost of production (wages and working conditions)

So to them, we are acting like a bunch of elitists. They sell the idea to the public everytime we want something. And the Walmart mommies and Wall Street daddies buy it.

The ONLY places we can turn for help are internally as ALPA has historically done; or externally as the IBT has done. ALPA puts up a picket line, has it's members fund it and pay strike benefits and hopes to bring management to it's knees in a deregulated environment where the strikers fellow union "brothers" shake their hand, write a check and then go to work...flying the passengers or cargo that their "brothers" are striking.

IBT, as recently seen with Amerijet, coalesced support from AFL-CIO unions, every other pilot union, the union that represent the Carribean refuelers where Amerijet flew, Congress (hearings), and everyoone else. They ALL supported those 60 pilots. The freight didn't move, the Amerijet offices and those of businesses in the building didn't get cleaned, the trash didn't get picked up, UPS and FedEx drivers didn't deliver, busses didn't pick up at the stop, other carriers found out if they hauled Amerijet cargo they would be struck...

And pilots walked the line supported both in person, unity AND financially by each person. A lot of money came out of wallets to support these guys.

See the picture?

When you cast a wide net, and don't turn your nose up or refer to other unions and incompetent or their members in derrogatory ways, amazing things happen.

It CAN be done. But just like safely operating the airplane...you gotta leave your ego at the door.

I think that might be what TDawg was talking about. Since he is a self proclaimed second generation airline brat (no slight there), I'd be interested in his first generations take.

 

This seems like a flash in the pan after observing the actions of Republic IBT with the Midwest takeover. Can't list any support from AFL-CIO or IBT747.

Do you remember Midwest pilots walking the line with Waste Management labor last year? No.. didn't think so.

Can't say I'm buying your words... but still listening.

 

I understand where you are better than you know. I have a few uniforms hanging in my closet as well.

Regarding the "takeover" by RAH management; don't forget that IBT begged ALPA National to come to the table. They said "no thanks, we're doing it OUR way." Which is fine, except that ALPA merger policy is not the guiding policy in a merger where a non ALPA carrier is the acquiring carrier. There are people like the IBT Airline Division's Deputy Director you can ask about this. He is a former 23 year ALPA Senior Contract Administrator and Negotiator. (He was one of the ones wrongfully "terminated" by ALPA during the contract negotiations) P/M me and I'll send you his contact info.

Yes, I do remember when your guys stood tall with WMI. I also remember there was a move to decert ALPA as well by a group of your pilots when you guys were getting shafted by ALPA National. Your shafting was partly political retribution for not supporting Prater when he ran for office. And given what has transpired, if I was your former MEC...I wouldn't change the vote.

You and your guys are in a crappy position. It was not created by the RAH pilots, the IBT, your MEC or you. I do know that the people who now run the Airline Division and Local 747 are very familiar (more than you can imagine) with your plight and believe that they will try to do whatever they can to help.

That said, those who continue to slap the RAH pilots and blame them for what happened or for the contract that was negotiated a long time ago serves no purpose other than to make them wonder why they should step up and help.

Just a thought...

 

JetBlue does NOT have a union..FYI..... anyone know what kinda of CBA was gained or any details that were fixed after the AmeriJet pilots stuck???

 

Whether I agree with your opinions of the RAH IBT or not you need to be corrected that there's a difference between a local and a national. You started off arguing what the IBT national is doing but used one local as your reasoning. Not the same.

 

I take offense to this statement. I worked for UPS and was a teamster for while working there. Don't worry, I think Unions, in general, are crooks. They are a necessary evil.