MD80

Where are the Teamsters with Duty Time proposals?

I never hear anything about the Teamsters union on safety, duty time, outsourcing flying, integration policy, .... At least ALPA is fight for US pilot in Washington D.C.

Think about it!

EmbraerFlyer

Teamsters is a garbage man's union. They have better benifits than I did as a teamsters pilot..

B7ER Guy

There's a reason a lot of groups are dumping IBT! Look no further than NJ pilots, ATI, and now North American. They don't represent the aviation industry well. I'll second what EmbraerFlyer said. They're a garbage man's union.

IronWalt

So if you want to end up with better pay then the choice would be Teamsters over ALPA then. Garbage men make better money than pilots who are represented by ALPA.

MD80

My question is...

Do you have information on Teamsters National getting involved in airline pilot issues or having a stand/help advancing our profession?

I have not.

ATCsaidDoWhat

Like Larry the Cable Guy says; "That there's just funny, I don't care who you are."

ALPA has done nothing about outsourcing pilot jobs. Ask the Atlas pilots who got a foreign base and crewmembers shoved down their throat. Eight years of lost seniority, out of seniority furloughs and lost flying. Only after they went to the IBT did the union...the IBT...get it closed.

Now UAL is going to do it...what's ALPA doing?

The IBT has been non stop on Capitol Hill fighting outsourcing of pilots and MRO's. They blocked Frontier's efforts to outsource and have just won two rounds of bringing back outsourced and offshore maintenance and aircraft refits at United...with more to come.

Meanwhile, how's ALPA's negotiation...oops, mediation...going over there?

They shutdown Amerijet and got them a first contract. With labor unions from every arena...yeah, including those dreaded "garbagemen" to come out in support of those 60 pilots. The support was from airline pilots from across the spectrum and thousands from the AFL-CIO, Teamsters and others...when has ALPA ever done that?

And the only union who DIDN'T show up?

ALPA National.

ALPA pilots and individual LEC's and MEC's supported them. IBT carriers, UPS, American, USAPA (East AND West), SWA...so many others...

The promised "delegation" from ALPA NEVER SHOWED or CALLED...

Flight Time and Duty Time? Go check the Congressional records on who's been up there. IBT Airline Division.

Who did Sully and Skiles ask to go to Capitol Hill with them and attend meetings on Flight Time and Duty Time? IBT Airline Division.

Who's working on crew outsourcing? Yep, those "garbagemen" again.

Who offered to sign a contract that would allow the pilots of ATI to be whipsawed against ANY pilot group? And give management a model of how to do it with other airlines? IF they decertified the IBT and joined ALPA???

ALPA

Who said they would not sign any agreement that allowed whipsawing of any pilot group against ANY carrier REGARDLESS of union affiliation?

IBT Airline Division

So under the new IBT Airline Division leadership, they have gotten rid of a corrupt Local president, forced an airline management to sign a contract with pay and benefit improvements and no concessions, gotten jobs back, working to negotiate better contracts than the past, ended a bunch of outsourcing, stood up against whipsawing, provided language for legislation on Capitol Hill protecting pilots, worked to revise retirements and pensions for pilots, and for the first time in the history of airline pilots, gotten people from ALL walks of life to stand up, walk the picket line and OPEN THEIR WALLETS to support PILOTS.

Yep, they lost ATI. Whose union leadership was in the pocket of the guy who got thrown out. Who was told if he'd take a whipsaw deal, the holding company would give him jets and jobs from ABX. IBT said "no"...Prater said, "come on over...I'll sign it!"

IBT lost ATI's 155 pilots because they wouldn't agree to whipsaw. ALPA lost USAPA because they wouldn't get off their ass to figure out how to address the seniority arbitration, and lost Atlas and Polar because Prater lied to their MEC about getting off his ass and getting a 3 year old merger done.

And then there's Midwest Express...your carrier MD80, right? Did Prater ever "change his zip code" as he promised? As I recall, he tossed you and your MEC to the wolves when he refused to provide financial assistance on the merger front.

No one ever said IBT does not have warts from past leadership. They are fixing that.

So far, all ALPA has done is call them "garbagemen, truckers, bakery workers..." not worthy of representing pilots.

I wonder how the guys at Pinnacle, Hawaiian, and even Midwest are faring under those new contracts? How about the new spiffy TA at ATN? That's where the IBT Airline Division just wrapped up a new contract for the mechanics too...with better pay and job security.

Their leadership works for probably less than 50% of the pay of the ALPA National leadership. How's that working out? Any ALPA leaders taking pay cuts while ALPA pilots are furloughed?

Odd thing is despite what you may think or will be told, I don't hate ALPA. I do however despise what the current elected leadership has done. They've run a great organization staffed by wonderful people into the crapper. They've failed miserably on every organizing drive except Colgan and ATN...who just wanted to go anywhere. They lost Skywest, JetBlue isn't interested nor are others. They are begging USAPA to come back, but that's not happening.

They've cut services and staff. Imposed work rules. Lost carriers. Can't pay the bills. And trash anyone who isn't ALPA.

Sounds like Airline Management 101.

Now they have an all out push to raid IBT carriers because they need the money to pay the bills.

That's what is sad. And ticks me off. Their refusal to admit mistakes and rectify them, and in doing so, hurting pilots and their families because of their arrogance and ego's.

Now...I will say...ALPA does have one thing over the Teamsters that the IBT will never have...

A really big inflatable rat...

TrojanCMH

IBT safety proposals = taking ALPAs proposals and changing the name to IBT.

ATCsaidDoWhat

Trojan...if you're so confident about that, why not call Don McClure at ALPA, 703-689-2270...ask him what's going on in the Air Safety office...or if anyone is even still working there with the pay and job cuts.

ATCsaidDoWhat

www.teamsterair.com

WeaselBoy

First, let me start off by saying that I am by no means a cheerleader for IBT.

Before, when RAH was only CHQ, the pilots tried to get ALPA for union representation. ALPA pretty much told them to go pound sand. That is one reason why many of the senior guys are still carrying a grudge against them. And frankly, after Prater threw the Colgan crew, and regionals as a whole, under the bus during the Congressional hearings I have no desire to send them any part of my paycheck. Unless your Delta, or one of the legacies, ALPA doesn't really seem to give a rodents rectum. Being Midwest I'm sure you're aware of that.

IBT knows lots of their pilots across its certificates are not happy. The RAH/ Midwest/ Frontier/ Lynx integration will make us almost half of the 747's total membership and many folks are talking of dumping the Teamsters. Some serious talk has been started about going independent and the local is worried. And so, lately the 747 has been trying to step up its game. They recently put out this press release that was carried by the AP and a few other news agencies. Eventually, it would up on the RJET stock news feed for Yahoo! and a few other financial websites:
Punitive Attendance Policies at Regional Air Carriers | International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT)
Apparently, when WH saw it going out to the investors he was PO'd and supposedly that was the reason for denying the now infamous FO pay LOA. While we knew there was no way in Dante's seventh circle that the LOA was going to pass (whole different ugly story) it was still nice to see Heller's cage rattled.

IBT knows lots of their pilots across many certificates are not happy. The RAH/ Midwest/ Frontier/ Lynx integration will make us almost half of the 747's total membership and many folks are not happy with the Teamsters. Some serious talk has been started about going independent and the local is worried.