I'd like to know what your company policy is with regards to flying a "stabilized approach". Please name your company if you're comfortable in doing so -- otherwise, just describe what is required.

I'm seeing most of our rookie Controllers issuing vectors inside the marker to all types of jets -- air carriers, regionals, and business jets. This is just something that I was never allowed to do in over 20 years of ATC with the FAA, unless of course, the pilot requested a "short approach". These vectors often mean that the crew is hauling ass, and expected to make 110 degree turn or more towards the airport without blowing through the final and impacting traffic on the straight-in approach to the parallel runway.

It seems to be a losing battle with these rookies. Trying to convince them to give you good vectors for a "stabilized approach" seems to be like ****ing in the wind, and they will slam you in front of straight-in traffic without batting an eye -- and then break-out the straight-in traffic because of a pending loss of separation.

So let's hear you thoughts on this matter... and specifically, what does your company require.

Thanks,

AUS_ATC

 

FedEx
Field VFR need to be stable at 500 ft AFL, IFR 1000 ft AFL
Aircraft in final landing configuration, airspeed within CFM limits and all briefings and checklist done. If on a instrument approach must be on the profile for the apch being flown. If on a visual in a position vertically and laterally so a normal descent and landing can be made.

Never let ATC fly your airplane or put you in a bad position. I had to have a talk to a supervisor in PIT because a controller got upset when we a A300 could not do 200kts to the marker. The controller actually was a smart a## on the radio mocking us. I simply said we have to be stable at 1000 AFL and give me your initials and a phone number.

 

I think what the Captain meant to say was Field VFR, stable at 500 ft AFL, Field IFR, stable at 1000 ft AFL

 

Stabile at 1000ft, configured for landing, at final approach speed, within Limits for the approach being flown, same for VFR. If we aren't a GA is the procedure.

 

Well I work for the hometown airline that is about a 2-3 hr. drive east of AUS. Basically, for a visual approach, we are told to take into consideration 3 approach energy management gates, the first being the FAF or no closer than 5 miles from the rwy threshold. Ideally at that point we should be 2000 to 1500 ft. above TDZE. with gear down, flaps 15, and max speed of 180 KIAS. The next gate is 1000ft above TDZE in final landing configuration and on some semblance of an acceptable glide path pointed at the touchdown zone. The final gate takes place at around 500' above TDZE and engines should be spooled (for 737 40% N1 is preferred), speed should be within the range for computed target on glide path with wings level and on course.

Thanks for asking I don’t pretend to speak for everyone but I find the slam dunks a little uncomfortable.

 

I just don't want anyone giving me a stressful time of it. If I'm not comfortable, I'm asking for vectors to take me further out. If I'm not stabilized, I'm going around. I'm not gonna fudge it because someone else is intimidating me.

I worked hard to get my license and I intend to keep it. Don't wanna fill out an ASAP and don't need the chief Pilot calling me. When I finish a trip I'm off the clock. I don't need to spend my days off second guessing my actions cos I let someone else set me up. I did push it one time to save fuel. Never again!

And yeah, I know what you're dealing with there. My sympathies!

Al

 

+1..............

 

Words to live by.

Like you, check the ego at the door.

Couldn't have said it better.

 

More PICs need to learn or exercise the word, "Unable" and possibly re-read what the responsibilities of the PIC are. Take one off the end and the controller is not going to be in front of the accident board.

At DFW a while back and 3 or 4 good indications of windshear (virga, big temp/dew point spread, dust devils) and ATC gave us 200 to the marker. "Unable." ATC says everyone else is doing it. "Unable." If you can't play with the big boys we can put you in holding. "Gimme vectors or the fix.. we got 2hrs of fuel.. initials and number please."

More to the story but the simple fact is we flew a stable app and didn't let the assumption of business as usual back us into a potential incident/accident.

 

We have a winner! What has created scenarios like being at 4,000 on down wind and being cleared for a "visual and make short approach" a la Chicago, or airplanes crossing the threshold while the other A/C is just rotating with the continuous encouraging words of ATC "continue approach" or take off clearance coming very slowly while the landing A/C is still with TR's deployed and the T/O A/C is already checking 80kts. by the time the words cleared for take off are actually uttered and the landing A/C bellow 300' on final a la Minneapolis. The pilots, that's who. We keep stretching the boundaries of the meaning of safe distance while padding each other on the back with phrases like "good job" before changing frequencies and the "good job" really means "boy that was close"

It is the gazelle that has given the cheetah its speed