UPS, SWA, FedEx Contracts & Industry.
09-07-2006, 02:06 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Posts: 722
I think that ChrisH's comments were completely misinterpreted. He was not bringing the value of the pilot's flying the plane into the mix. You have to see his angle, where the "precious CARGO" in the back are people versus boxes. For that reason alone you would hope that you can rationalize that pilots flying passengers should be entitled to at least the same compensation that someone flying boxes around is earning.
By all means, the best thing we can all hope for is that everyone starts making more money, and that doesn't just include guys in the airlines. When the industry as a whole becomes profitable everyone from top to bottom will reap the rewards (IMHO!)
By all means, the best thing we can all hope for is that everyone starts making more money, and that doesn't just include guys in the airlines. When the industry as a whole becomes profitable everyone from top to bottom will reap the rewards (IMHO!)
09-07-2006, 02:13 PM
#12
New ride...
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Posts: 534
Originally Posted by ChrisH
My point was that 100 lives are worth more than 100 boxes.
You can't look at it that way, and I beg to differ with you. And I'll tell you why. Look at the DC8 fire we (UPS) just had recently in PHL. Those three guys in the cockpit did a PHENOMINAL job in bringing a BURNING airplane down for a safe landing. We all know what would have happened if that a/c had crashed short in some neighborhood. Look at the FedEx DC10 in SWF. They did a PHENOMINAL job in getting that a/c on the ground safely. These guys are heroes and ultimate professionals. It's about time that our managements will have to pay higher wages.
A pilot is a pilot is a pilot. I don't care if you have a plane full of pax or rubber dogsh*t out of Hong Kong, but we all do the same job. Only difference is when we fly and what part of the airport we park at.
09-07-2006, 02:48 PM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: 737 Right
Posts: 1,385
Originally Posted by ChrisH
LOL, I didn't mean it like that, that came out way wrong, and I apologize. My point was that 100 lives are worth more than 100 boxes.
Secondly, the passengers themselves change travel plans based on a $5 difference in ticket price, driving the price of tickets into the basement. The same people will send an envelope on an airplane for $12 and not blink at the price.
Do the math and it turns out that the boxes are actually worth more than people, at least that's what the paying customer says.
09-07-2006, 03:11 PM
#14
Just happy to be here
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: 777 FO
Posts: 163
Originally Posted by 1Seat 1Engine
Sounds like a safe assumption but...You can put a lot more boxes than people in an airplane (although passengers frequently feel like they're stacked like boxes).
Secondly, the passengers themselves change travel plans based on a $5 difference in ticket price, driving the price of tickets into the basement. The same people will send an envelope on an airplane for $12 and not blink at the price.
Do the math and it turns out that the boxes are actually worth more than people, at least that's what the paying customer says.
Secondly, the passengers themselves change travel plans based on a $5 difference in ticket price, driving the price of tickets into the basement. The same people will send an envelope on an airplane for $12 and not blink at the price.
Do the math and it turns out that the boxes are actually worth more than people, at least that's what the paying customer says.
).
09-07-2006, 04:18 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: DD->DH->RU/XE soon to be EV
Posts: 3,732
Originally Posted by 1Seat 1Engine
Sounds like a safe assumption but...You can put a lot more boxes than people in an airplane (although passengers frequently feel like they're stacked like boxes).
Secondly, the passengers themselves change travel plans based on a $5 difference in ticket price, driving the price of tickets into the basement. The same people will send an envelope on an airplane for $12 and not blink at the price.
Do the math and it turns out that the boxes are actually worth more than people, at least that's what the paying customer says.
Secondly, the passengers themselves change travel plans based on a $5 difference in ticket price, driving the price of tickets into the basement. The same people will send an envelope on an airplane for $12 and not blink at the price.
Do the math and it turns out that the boxes are actually worth more than people, at least that's what the paying customer says.
Yeah, I know that people insure their freight and UPS/FDX, ect have to pay for service failures for late delivery or whatever.
09-07-2006, 05:10 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 184
Originally Posted by 1800 RVR
A pilot is a pilot is a pilot. I don't care if you have a plane full of pax or rubber dogsh*t out of Hong Kong, but we all do the same job.
09-08-2006, 03:31 AM
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 679
ChrisH...
Pilots get paid not because they fly passengers or boxes, they get paid because their skills generate revenue for the company. It just so happens that boxes generate more revenue than people do. Your logic fails when you consider that charter outfits that flew people prior to 9/11 didn't make the same as dal or ual. Aren't the people valuable on all those planes too? When the pax carriers start charging more for their product so a plane full of pax generates the revenue of a plane full of boxes, then you might have a reason for the pax guys to ask for more money.
JMO
Pilot7576
Pilots get paid not because they fly passengers or boxes, they get paid because their skills generate revenue for the company. It just so happens that boxes generate more revenue than people do. Your logic fails when you consider that charter outfits that flew people prior to 9/11 didn't make the same as dal or ual. Aren't the people valuable on all those planes too? When the pax carriers start charging more for their product so a plane full of pax generates the revenue of a plane full of boxes, then you might have a reason for the pax guys to ask for more money.
JMO
Pilot7576
09-08-2006, 06:08 AM
#18
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 38
I personally believe the pay should by "up" not just because of the responsibility, specialized training, experience, etc, but because of the sacrafice of being away from home more than a few nights a month.
Family life is very important to most of us here, so I feel that yet another reason for fair pay/benefits is to help offset being away, whether flying pax and/or boxes.
jj
Family life is very important to most of us here, so I feel that yet another reason for fair pay/benefits is to help offset being away, whether flying pax and/or boxes.
jj
09-08-2006, 06:14 AM
#19
done, gone skiing
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Rocking chair
Posts: 1,601
Freight ain't SEXY
I think ChrisH is one of a long and distinguished line of pilots who (while tipping thier hat currently) accept the reality of post 9/11 (on pax carriers). I beleive he is uncomfortable with the fact that a cargo pilot can make more money than a "real" airline pilot. 
How many pax pilots would have jumped to fly for FDX or UPS prior to the recent melt down in pay and benefits?? How about the SWA guys right now, how many can honestly say they'd rather be doing our job rather than theirs??
Fly ing freight will never be a glamorous as pax flying (in many pilots eyes) but it does have some advantages, at least in the current environment.
How many pax pilots would have jumped to fly for FDX or UPS prior to the recent melt down in pay and benefits?? How about the SWA guys right now, how many can honestly say they'd rather be doing our job rather than theirs??
Fly ing freight will never be a glamorous as pax flying (in many pilots eyes) but it does have some advantages, at least in the current environment.
09-08-2006, 06:25 AM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,151
Originally Posted by Fartknocker
Yeah, I agree. I heard that FedEx averages about 800,000 of those little letters a night during the sort. That's a lot of envelopes ($ ).
).
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