USAPA loses LOA93
#91
Since AirTran was headquartered in Georgia, I thought those legislators would be most incentivized to amend the legislation. Claire McCaskill and Kit Bond are/were both Senators from Missouri where TWA was headquartered. They authored the legislation after what was done to the pilots of their state.
Carl
Carl
#92
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 5,038
Very, Very Wrong. The pilots of AirTran voted on their own fate. They did not in any way use the protections of the legislation under McCaskill-Bond. My personal opinion is that they would have done much better in arbitration using the fair integration precedent of Mc-Bond. But, I certainly understand their decision when their jobs were potentially on the line. Not trying to open up the SWA SLI debate again, that is water under the bridge. I am just trying to cast my opinion and refute your claim that the legislation is "worthless".
#93
Banned
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,480
However, they voted for the agreement and now they have to live with it. Unlike LCC pilots who agreed to binding arbitration then rejected the outcome. AAI guys may have gotten screwed, but they have enough personal honor to abide by their agreements.
You can't say that about Pickleballers.
#94
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,619
Again, there is no "ALPA side", only a USAPA side and a LLC Corp. side. It was a grievance filed by USAPA, and the NC/MEC members who were a part of creating LOA 93 are presumably still at LCC....
No one here knows factually why none of the other individuals who were party choose to participate. However, it's not encouraging to the USAPA argument that no one else involved on the LOA creation wanted to testify.
No one here knows factually why none of the other individuals who were party choose to participate. However, it's not encouraging to the USAPA argument that no one else involved on the LOA creation wanted to testify.
Mr. Hollerbach has not been called as a witness by the Union in their case. He was a member of their Negotiating Committee. He signed Letter 93. He was present on June 23, 2004. His email says in unequivocal terms that this grievance is bogus, bogus.
He writes: "There was one mention of a snapback in the negotiations surrounding LOA 93, and that was on day one. The first pass of the pilots' proposal to the Company, where we addressed a snapback to previous rates. The Company unequivocally rejected the notion as the financial situation was so dire, and it was dire, that to achieve financing, a projected snapback would not be received favorably by lenders or investors."
Continuing, ALPA Negotiating Committee Member Hollerbach says: "There is no snapback, no term on the rates, no term on the rates except that the contract becomes amendable on December 31, 2009. To tell you that USAPA doesn't have a chance in this grievance is an understatement."
He concludes by saying: "Trust me. I would love a snapback to previous rates, but I won't commit perjury."
He writes: "There was one mention of a snapback in the negotiations surrounding LOA 93, and that was on day one. The first pass of the pilots' proposal to the Company, where we addressed a snapback to previous rates. The Company unequivocally rejected the notion as the financial situation was so dire, and it was dire, that to achieve financing, a projected snapback would not be received favorably by lenders or investors."
Continuing, ALPA Negotiating Committee Member Hollerbach says: "There is no snapback, no term on the rates, no term on the rates except that the contract becomes amendable on December 31, 2009. To tell you that USAPA doesn't have a chance in this grievance is an understatement."
He concludes by saying: "Trust me. I would love a snapback to previous rates, but I won't commit perjury."
So the reason that other people wouldn't testify is that they knew this grievance was bogus, they knew that no snapback had been negotiated, and they had too much integrity to lie to an arbitrator. Even the one negotiator who showed up didn't really talk about snapback, he concentrated on the word freeze and how a pay freeze and a training freeze were just the same because of, well, the word freeze.
Everyone that negotiated this knew there was no snapback. This was our favorite DPA lawyer creating billable hours while the USAPA leadership fed one more deception to their pilots. Carl tries to paint this as some ALPA failure when in fact it was just further flailing on the part of USAPA.
Just to recap the legal situation at USAPA:
Seham has been fired
USAPA quit paying his bills and hired a firm to audit his billing practices
Seham filed a lien on the legal files and now USAPA has no access to their previous case history
Seham has filed a lawsuit against John and Jane Doe, allegedly a USAPA officer, who created a fake email address and sent fake emails supposedly from a lawyer
USAPA has an injunction filed against them for illegal job action
USAPA faces millions in damages as a result of illegal job action
USAPA just had their butts handed to them in federal court (again) on the declaratory action. There is agreement on a move towards summary judgement on counts one and two of the company's action and by the sound of it, USAPA is in for a rude awakening
USAPA has another phony Pension Investigation that is now out of money. They are assessing the East pilots who are now paying more than ALPA dues rates.
USAPA is broke
#95
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Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
If you read the transcript you will find this little nugget:
Hollerbach is a current LCC pilot who would get a 40% raise if they won the grievance.
So the reason that other people wouldn't testify is that they knew this grievance was bogus, they knew that no snapback had been negotiated, and they had too much integrity to lie to an arbitrator. Even the one negotiator who showed up didn't really talk about snapback, he concentrated on the word freeze and how a pay freeze and a training freeze were just the same because of, well, the word freeze.
Everyone that negotiated this knew there was no snapback. This was our favorite DPA lawyer creating billable hours while the USAPA leadership fed one more deception to their pilots. Carl tries to paint this as some ALPA failure when in fact it was just further flailing on the part of USAPA.
Just to recap the legal situation at USAPA:
Seham has been fired
USAPA quit paying his bills and hired a firm to audit his billing practices
Seham filed a lien on the legal files and now USAPA has no access to their previous case history
Seham has filed a lawsuit against John and Jane Doe, allegedly a USAPA officer, who created a fake email address and sent fake emails supposedly from a lawyer
USAPA has an injunction filed against them for illegal job action
USAPA faces millions in damages as a result of illegal job action
USAPA just had their butts handed to them in federal court (again) on the declaratory action. There is agreement on a move towards summary judgement on counts one and two of the company's action and by the sound of it, USAPA is in for a rude awakening
USAPA has another phony Pension Investigation that is now out of money. They are assessing the East pilots who are now paying more than ALPA dues rates.
USAPA is broke
Hollerbach is a current LCC pilot who would get a 40% raise if they won the grievance.
So the reason that other people wouldn't testify is that they knew this grievance was bogus, they knew that no snapback had been negotiated, and they had too much integrity to lie to an arbitrator. Even the one negotiator who showed up didn't really talk about snapback, he concentrated on the word freeze and how a pay freeze and a training freeze were just the same because of, well, the word freeze.
Everyone that negotiated this knew there was no snapback. This was our favorite DPA lawyer creating billable hours while the USAPA leadership fed one more deception to their pilots. Carl tries to paint this as some ALPA failure when in fact it was just further flailing on the part of USAPA.
Just to recap the legal situation at USAPA:
Seham has been fired
USAPA quit paying his bills and hired a firm to audit his billing practices
Seham filed a lien on the legal files and now USAPA has no access to their previous case history
Seham has filed a lawsuit against John and Jane Doe, allegedly a USAPA officer, who created a fake email address and sent fake emails supposedly from a lawyer
USAPA has an injunction filed against them for illegal job action
USAPA faces millions in damages as a result of illegal job action
USAPA just had their butts handed to them in federal court (again) on the declaratory action. There is agreement on a move towards summary judgement on counts one and two of the company's action and by the sound of it, USAPA is in for a rude awakening
USAPA has another phony Pension Investigation that is now out of money. They are assessing the East pilots who are now paying more than ALPA dues rates.
USAPA is broke
You're wrong about quite a bit of this. Want to check it over? I'll get back to you.
#96
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Speaking French
Posts: 385
#97
Just to recap the legal situation at USAPA:
Seham has been fired
USAPA quit paying his bills and hired a firm to audit his billing practices
Seham filed a lien on the legal files and now USAPA has no access to their previous case history
Seham has filed a lawsuit against John and Jane Doe, allegedly a USAPA officer, who created a fake email address and sent fake emails supposedly from a lawyer
USAPA has an injunction filed against them for illegal job action
USAPA faces millions in damages as a result of illegal job action
USAPA just had their butts handed to them in federal court (again) on the declaratory action. There is agreement on a move towards summary judgement on counts one and two of the company's action and by the sound of it, USAPA is in for a rude awakening
USAPA has another phony Pension Investigation that is now out of money. They are assessing the East pilots who are now paying more than ALPA dues rates.
USAPA is broke
Every East pilot has paid $1,600 in assessments tilting at windmills over their terminated pension, hoping for another Hail Mary in that area. Ain't gonna happen.
#98
Banned
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
Last edited by cactiboss; 12-11-2011 at 12:49 PM.
#99
Just sayin.
Carl
#100
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