Wow, do you even read what you write, or do you have such an imagination that it doesn't matter. Do you even have a shred of integrity?

I did not say 76 seat jets create jobs, show me where I said that. You claim that 76 seat jets steal jobs. I ask you to prove it. I give you evidence that exactly the opposite has happened over the last 5 years and yet you try to twist my words around to say something I didn't say. You learned form Carl well.

It seems to me that you continue to stand behind a theory that has been proven wrong time after time. So I ask you to provide evidence that your theory is correct. In this negotiation, we worked to ensure that 100 seat aircraft came to mainline. In order to do that Delta needed to reduce DCI capacity. In order to do that, they needed 76 seat jets to entice the DCI carriers to break their contracts.

That was what this negotiation was about. You claim, falsely, that this will steal jobs and result in mainline shrinkage. Prove it. Show some empirical evidence that backs up your theory. You throw around phony numbers from phony spreadsheets and phony analysis and them claim you have some proof. I show you real world evidence that disproves your phony theories and then you try to twist my words into saying I support outsourcing.

That is not what I said. What I showed you was that outsourcing 76 seat aircraft has not shown to have any correlation with mainline growth or mainline jobs. In fact, the opposite has been shown to be true. They can be dependent events (adding 76 seaters causes mainline growth) or independent (adding 76 seaters have no effect one way or the other). You make the definitive claim that mainline growth is directly dependent (in a negative way) upon 76 seat jets and yet your theory has been shown to be false 100% of the time in the real world. Yet you stand behind it.

DALPA supported the merger in part because a larger airline will support upgauging markets and reducing the reliance on outsourcing. That theory has been shown to be true. DCI has lost over 200 aircraft since the merger and every statistic show that mainline is doing a larger share of the domestic flying since then. This agreement accelerates that trend. Instead of looking at real evidence, you stand behind your phony numbers and your discredited theories. These 76 seaters will simply be replacing flying that is done by 50 seaters and more work is being transferred to mainline. Looks like hiring will begin within 6 months or less.

But hey, the truth has never stopped you before, why start now? Maybe you are so angry that your phony theories have been shown to be wrong again you will just lash out. A little childish.

interesting questions newk.

thanks.
hard to do on an iphone.

anyways, does beg the old question, where should we draw the line on the size of an outsourced jet? if the reason we outsource is becase they can do it cheaper and that's good for us, why be fools and stop it at 76 seaters?

Blame 9-11 and the resulting BK. Those were extreme events that changed this industry forever. We parked L1011s early at that time due to those events too, and I guess you will blame ALPA for that? ACL could have been an L10 FE I suppose too, but ALPA didn't do enough to stop them from leaving, after they became uneconomical themselves......

Getting rid of as many outsourced jets as possible should be the main goal. This contract is doing that, along with caps and favorable ratios.

Another good post. This would make a great X-Files movie.

The L1011 wouldn't have been replaced by a jumbo RJ.

How many DC-9s by the way did NWA have on 31DEC08, i.e. after the merger? As in, how many survived 9/11?

^^^ easy question, look at Delta 2008 10-k, you don't have to have a copy of the contract or access to deltanet to do it. :D

Damn T, I had to google that one...pretty good for a UT guy:D. As far as SWA hiring I have no idea what their plans or retirement numbers are. I was merely comparing 6th year DAL W2 to a 6th year SWA W2. DALPA told me I wasn't supposed to do that, yet they wanna compare us to AA and CAL wrt scope, pay etc... Grand scheme of things it doesn't matter. I voted no, you voted yes and yet we could still drink beer and talk football all night I'm sure.

The scope in Delta pilot's contract is based on the certificated MGTOW, not the actual MGTOW. Therefore, they may not simply adjust the seats to meet the weight requirement.

Can't happen. Not allowed by Delta pilot scope.

You never claimed to be a contract expert and you state it that way to show it is your opinion, but yet days before the vote ended you post this:

I should try not to be confused?

As far as how to project what is opinion and what is fact, it seems like you might be the confused one, Bill. You use "will" when you should use "I think," or "may/might" and vice-versa. Or, at least I think you do. ;)

If I am confused, it is not about where anything is in the new contract. My confusion, if any, has to do with you and your posts.
Before the TA passed: Brash certainty to the point where you insult the intelligence of anyone who disagrees with you.
After the TA passed: Deferential questioning with slight praise of the same people you insulted.

(That type of reversal will get a :confused: from me every time.)

New K