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DAL vs. NW Pay

Old 10-01-2008, 07:40 PM
  #1  
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Default DAL vs. NW Pay

I am posting this here to correct a misperception that has been repeatedly brought up. This was on the DAL message boards but I believe it originated on the NW boards. Not that it really matters much anymore, but it refutes some bad gouge that was floating around a couple of months ago.

Scoop



Pay Rumor: NWA vs. DAL
It has been brought to the attention of the NWA MEC leadership that some pilots believe that when we go
to the DAL pay and work rules, pay raises will be a wash. The foundation of this belief is that we will get a
pay raise followed by less working hours. This is a rumor.
This incorrect statement computes pay based on our NWA monthly max to DAL Average Line Value
(ALV), as if ALV was the max for the month. This is not the case. The ALV is the average. To get the max
for the month, 7.5 hours would need to be added to the monthly ALV (see chart below). In addition, last
year the average pay for DAL pilots was round 84 hours per month; making it possible to get more hours of
pay under the DAL system vs. the current NWA pay system.
NWA DAL
Monthly MAX 90 hrs. Monthly MAX 90 hrs.
Monthly Range
(max -12 hrs)
90-78 hrs. Monthly Range
(max -12 hrs)
90-78 hrs.
Monthly MIN. 75 hrs. Monthly MIN. 75 hrs.
Monthly Range
(min -12 hrs)
75-63 hrs. Monthly Range
(min -12 hrs)
75-63 hrs.
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Old 10-01-2008, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Scoop View Post
I am posting this here to correct a misperception that has been repeatedly brought up. This was on the DAL message boards but I believe it originated on the NW boards. Not that it really matters much anymore, but it refutes some bad gouge that was floating around a couple of months ago.

Scoop



Pay Rumor: NWA vs. DAL
It has been brought to the attention of the NWA MEC leadership that some pilots believe that when we go
to the DAL pay and work rules, pay raises will be a wash. The foundation of this belief is that we will get a
pay raise followed by less working hours. This is a rumor.
This incorrect statement computes pay based on our NWA monthly max to DAL Average Line Value
(ALV), as if ALV was the max for the month. This is not the case. The ALV is the average. To get the max
for the month, 7.5 hours would need to be added to the monthly ALV (see chart below). In addition, last
year the average pay for DAL pilots was round 84 hours per month; making it possible to get more hours of
pay under the DAL system vs. the current NWA pay system.
NWA DAL
Monthly MAX 90 hrs. Monthly MAX 90 hrs.
Monthly Range
(max -12 hrs)
90-78 hrs. Monthly Range
(max -12 hrs)
90-78 hrs.
Monthly MIN. 75 hrs. Monthly MIN. 75 hrs.
Monthly Range
(min -12 hrs)
75-63 hrs. Monthly Range
(min -12 hrs)
75-63 hrs.
Scoop,

The NWA Comm committee pulled it tonight, said they will update it.

The error looks to me like it's in the table as they both match. Probably get something tomorrow.

Anybody you know going to the arbritration?

Ferd
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Old 10-01-2008, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Ferd149 View Post
Scoop,

The NWA Comm committee pulled it tonight, said they will update it.

The error looks to me like it's in the table as they both match. Probably get something tomorrow.

Anybody you know going to the arbritration?

Ferd
Ferd,
No, I thought the arbitartion was closed. Anyhow, I hope we get a fair list. More importantly, or perhaps, maybe just as important, I hope management knows what they are doing and we have a solid growing company. I know that in todays business climate thats asking for a lot. From what I have read lately the "Network" guy that we picked up from CAL is kicking ass - lets just hope he is around for the long haul. I don't think the flight hour issue will be a big deal - most months you can always pick up open time. I for one always bid "minimum credit," this will try to build me a line below the ALV. Every guy that does this enables others to fly above the ALV.

Scoop
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Old 10-01-2008, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Scoop View Post
Ferd,
No, I thought the arbitartion was closed. Anyhow, I hope we get a fair list. More importantly, or perhaps, maybe just as important, I hope management knows what they are doing and we have a solid growing company. I know that in todays business climate thats asking for a lot. From what I have read lately the "Network" guy that we picked up from CAL is kicking ass - lets just hope he is around for the long haul. I don't think the flight hour issue will be a big deal - most months you can always pick up open time. I for one always bid "minimum credit," this will try to build me a line below the ALV. Every guy that does this enables others to fly above the ALV.

Scoop
Yeah I hope so too and I agree, we are going to be a world class game changer. The first national airline since PanAm?

The last I've heard the arbritation is open to us, our families but no press. However, I've also heard it's in a real small room . Should get a transcript of day one maybe Friday night.

Good luck my friend,
Ferd
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Old 10-02-2008, 10:45 AM
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I believe they are going to update it to reflect the actual max pickup limit at DAL which is the ALV plus 15 hours. In addition swaps have no limits meaning you can swap a 3 day trip for a 6 day trip as long as you are FAR legal.

What I find interesting is that both sides seem to want to claim high monthly hours as a benefit. Nothing could be further from the truth. A cap is the cornerstone of a contract and we need to work to reduce the caps not increase them. I remember flying with a new hire FE when we had a hard cap of 78 hours. He was upset the union was blocking him from flying as much as he wanted like his old airline. I asked him why he would want that. He said to make more money. I pointed out to him that if we dropped the cap his income would be zero since he would be quickly furloughed. Delta went from 10,300 pilots to less then 7000 in 4 years. Part of it was a reduction in the fleet however most of it was because of contractual changes allowing when all is said and done pilots to fly to FAR Limits.
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