Fact: Nobody on this board knows if it was an inadvertant (albeit unprofessional) error or blatant deception
Fact: The error was discovered, noted, and I believe, corrected
Fact: The issue is out of everyone's collective hands...it's in the hands of the arbitrators now
Fact: We are all soon to be one big happy family whether we like it or not. The time for arguments and posturing has passed.
Conclusion: No matter what, some of you guys are always going to be whiny little b!tche$. All people make errors. Some people lie, cheat and steal to get ahead in life. Either way, it's over. Suck it up and move on.

My statement is not as silly as this thread. Even if it was true, what are you going to do about it? Do think you're a hero who will uncover the conspiracy and have tickertape parade in your honor? You accuse the NWA MEC of "shennigans" and you don't even know if it was a mistake or not.

It's OVER. Quit reaching for straws, and let it go.

How are the arbitrators going to make a "fair" decision if they are not given "honest" information?

I'm sorry fellas, but I don't think giving inaccurate information to the arbitrators is "playing by the rules".

What if the DALPA team hadn't caught these errors (intentional or not)?

I promised myself I'd stay off this thread, but I can't help myself.

I still believe your concerns were covered in cross and are not an issue.

Cog........here is my offer. Lets go through the Delta closing argument when it comes out today, and if this is mentioned by your lawyer as an issue, I will gladly and publicly apologize for what I've said. I elected a rep who elected a merger committee (yes different from your system) so we are in fact all somewhat responsible.

If not, we let it all go and move on together. Deal?

Ferd

I want to see a thread with "hi jinks" in it as well.

Ready to don the hat and button the double-breasted navy coat. Well, not really, but ready to get on with "One great airline." :D

There was no deception, no use of false data, no invented job value units, no bogus flight plans or suspect career models based on incorrect monthly pay hours in concluding that the DC-9 is significantly smaller, significantly older, has significantly less range and pays significantly less than anything in the DAL fleet.

There's a difference between drawing a different conclusion based on the facts, and introducing bogus information to support your conclusion.

When the facts support your argument, you don't have to invent them.

This is getting out of hand. To use the rape analogy!!!! Do you know anyone who has ever been raped? Do you? And now you are saying the nwa alpa has raped you! Give me a&**^I& break. You have lost all credibility and I am very concerned with the group of pilots we are about to merging with. Let me respond.

1) Pilots on LTS/medically retired are capable of coming back on the list. I.E have you ever heard of cancer.

2) Our furlough plan was acknowledge, even on this board, to respond to the oil prices hitting 150. In lieu of sending every new hire packing we took leaves/partial leaves/early retirement/and lower monthly caps to avert a furlough. (Team effort kind of thing)

3) You dal guys are quick to make statements about our integrity and assume we are out to rake you over the coals. And you find enjoyment in accepting that. However the fact remains it is your union that was unwilling to move off of their position. We were the ones who offered up 32 compromises! Not you sir! Let's be straight about this. I asked on this forum for any of Dal guys to man up and tell how you would be willing to compromise and not one of you have responded. You want your cake and eat it too. But, now that Bloch and company are saying things that make you nervous like acknowledging that doh settlements have never had subsequent lawsuits or that Bloch would not be interested in your ratio that would be extremely tilted in Dal's favor in five years and even more so in ten years. I could go on. But instead of being upset with your mec for not going to the middle, which hey, would have gained 900 numbers on average for the mid to junior dal guys, you are making incredibly rude remarks about us. You want to do something productive, call your reps and tell them to go the middle or risk the chance that Bloch and company might not buy into your superior pilot group thing and award doh with a fence.

Finally, I know someone close to me that was raped and to equate the northwest pilot group with that guy, you sir, well, I can use not the type of words I need to form my response to you.

Here Here!

While I agree with you that the analogy used was completely reprehensible, using one individual's comments as the basis for concern about a group is rather silly, don't you think?

There are individuals on both sides, on this forum, and other sites, who indulge in hyperboly. Whether for sport, or just because they are like that, to equate them to a representative whole is stereotyping.

And I forgot about the conspiracy of the short release. You know the thing that your mecs guys thought we were making up to inflate our 330 performance numbers. And we had to elementarily explain, in a oh my god you've got to be kidding me fashion, that long haul flights use the rerelease method to reduce the 10% international fuel requirement, thus needing less fuel per leg. And less fuel needed etc. Do I need to go on?

But what does northwest know about short releases? We've only been flying to asia since the forties.

I can't find my old post, which I wrote prior the arbritration kicking off, but as some will recall I wrote about my experience as a jury member in a lawsuit between a Hollywood producer and Blockbuster Inc over the move "Monster". I talked alot about how lawyers operate and how each side painted the other as gold digging morons. Was fun to watch and in every case I was glad I wasn't the guy being grilled on the stand. I hate to say "I told you so" on how this would play out, but..............

Now, where are we at the end of all this? Our lawyer painted Delta pilots as gold digging, seniority grabbing jurks. Delta's lawyer painted us as dishonest, cheating data manipulators who will con very experienced arbritators to gain a windfall.

Am I accurate in the two positions?

Once again, this thread is nuts as a minimum and bogas and insulting as a maximum.

Ferd

Agree 100%

Oopps, that's what I get for drinking and posting LOL I meant December ;)

Now that is funny.

Just another case of PWUI (Posting While Under the Influence). :) A fairly common occurrence on these boards that normally livens things up.

Scoop

Hey moderators,

Shut this thread down. This is a public forum read by many and to let the Dal guys get away with equating us northwest guys with rapist is beyond out of line. All credibility is lost. Shut this thread down. It's disgusting.

NWA SLI Shenanigans...title says it all.

Shut this thread down please...and the rape comment...unbelievable.

Deal Out of town and haven't seen the transcripts. What was the verdict.

Cog

Got to love Super Troopers. At this point I just hope when I get displaced I can fly with Carl!

Oh give it a rest. I never said NWA pilots ever raped anyone. It was an analogy which illustrates that if someone does something that is less than ethical, you don´t just suck it up and move on.

Maybe if I had used the following analogy it wouldn´t have been so hard on your sensibilities.


"Hey some one just stole my kitty cat."

"Relax, it´s over, suck it up."

Of course, maybe you know someone who had a kitty cat stolen so I might presume too much.


The bottom line is that there is a disturbing pattern of using suspicious, or incorrect data, which coincidentally always supports the arguments the NWA merger committee puts forth.

BTW, what were those 32 compromises, were they a variation of your DOH proposal, or did you move off of your original proposal and finally settle on DOH? I wonder what the previous 31 proposals must have looked like, because your last proposal has nearly 3000 DAL pilots stapled to the bottom of your list after a few years. Yeah that´s fair and equitable. Why oh why did we not jump on that offer?

Your posts are disrespectful and are best left off of this site. Flames like yours are best left on FI. Lets keep this site at least semi-professional.

Nothing out last night. I'll check Monday. They were supposed to written closings so probably out after the weekend?

Then I get to go out of town. SOME of us get to work the holiday........

Happy Thanksgiving Cogman.

Ferd

You too Fred. Last beating of the dead horse! I get that the hearings are over and we are arguing over mute points but it still bothers me that, A- any of this is true, and B- few if any NWA guys seem to be troubled by it, and C- how will/did it affect the arbitors decision.

Happy Thanksgiving from 80 degree PHX

Coghttp://www.airlinepilotforums.com/im...cons/icon7.gif

It still looks like the arbitrators will shape the list but it will be negotiated. Both sides are meeting and talking with the arbitrators back providing guidence. The end result I suspect will be a negotiated list that mirrors what the arbitrators would have awarded.

I've always thought it would play out that way........I let Denny talk me out of it;).

Good, I still think something negotiated is better for all.......but maybe then they can still blame it on the "wise men"?

Ferd
Jury Member #12

I'd be careful about going against Denny...he's never lost a case. Why? - Because he's DennyCrane.

Carl - not DennyCrane

My favorite sceene:

Denny - How bout a quicky

Shirley - (whispering in his ear) Denny Crane!

Denny - Big Smile

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

That's it. Keep the insults coming.

Am I they only one that can't find the rape reference Opus talks about? Seriously.

Ferd and Carl,

I'm ususally a glass half full kinda guy but after reading here and elsewhere about the SLI, I've kinda gotten into the glass half empty side. I do hope the list is negotiated and my record will still be intact......I didn't loose in court!!!!!:D

Good thing Alan is not on here or he and I would have to have some words about Shirley.....he's tryin' to use my mad cow to get into Shirleys knickers!!! That'll be the last memory I loose!!!!!:D

I look forward to meeting you guys for real someday?!!:D

Denny

How is a line from Hamlet an insult? (Hamlet, Act 3, Scene 2)

Looks like it was removed. Rightfully so. Let's just move on folks. There is nothing to see here. :rolleyes:

deleted...

It is to anyone who failed English Lit in school....:eek::rolleyes:

It was deleted. Thank you moderators.

Me too Denny. I'm just worried you won't remember me after we meet. :D

Carl

Those "mute" points never seem to sink in, its as if I am not hearing what you are saying.. Oh well maybe they are "moot," as well. :)

Scoop

Word of the day.... Pedantic. :D

You too Denny!!

We need to have an APC reunion when the smoke clears. Everyone can only wear their APC names on their "Hi my name is" tags:D. You ATL guys have to know a good dive somewherez down there while we're in southern charm school................