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Old 12-15-2007 | 09:32 PM
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Default Carrier Wives Tale?

A question for all you USN pointy nose flyers. I heard recently that night, carrier launches can induce vertigo and give the assemblance that you're inverted just after you leave the ship. Is this true?

(Just a random question from an ignorant civilian pilot...call me LT if you want...)
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Old 12-15-2007 | 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by BoilerWings
A question for all you USN pointy nose flyers. I heard recently that night, carrier launches can induce vertigo and give the assemblance that you're inverted just after you leave the ship. Is this true?

(Just a random question from an ignorant civilian pilot...call me LT if you want...)
True:Night cat shots can definitely induce vertigo. Just grabbing from my FAA file, Navy taught us same stuff. It's all flight surgeons these days <g>.

"Vestibular Illusions (Somatogravic - Utricle and Saccule) Illusions involving the utricle and the saccule of the vestibular system are most likely under conditions with unreliable or unavailable external visual references. These illusions include: the Inversion Illusion, Head-Up Illusion, and Head-Down Illusion. A B C
The Inversion Illusion involves a steep ascent (forward linear acceleration)
in a high-performance aircraft, followed by a sudden return to level flight
. When the pilot levels off, the aircraft’s speed is relatively higher. This combination of accelerations produces an illusion that the aircraft is in inverted flight. The pilot’s response to this illusion is to lower the nose of the aircraft.

"The Head-Up Illusion involves a sudden forward linear acceleration during level flight where the pilot perceives the illusion that the nose of the aircraft is pitching up. The pilot’s response to this illusion would be to push the yolk or the stick forward to pitch the nose of the aircraft down. A night take-off from a well-lit airport into a totally dark sky (black hole) or a catapult take-off
from an aircraft carrier can also lead to this illusion, and could result in a
crash."
The head Down Illusion is caused by rapid deceleration: If you get that on the cat, you eject! (Cold cat at night......)
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Old 12-16-2007 | 01:00 AM
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BoilerWings,

SaltyDog's info is correct (good stuff SD)

I've done several night cat shots (4K hours Navy fighters, A-6, F-14, FA-18, 802 traps total).

The acceleration of the cat shot (0 to 140 kts in 3 seconds) causes your inner ear to make you "feel" like you have pitched down when the acceleration of the cat shot ends. You "feel" like you are pointed nose down at the water (not "inverted" as you mention in your question). You must ignore this "feel" and fly instruments only. Your "feel" would have you yank the stick back, at very slow airspeed and very low altitude, cuasing you to stall and hammer-head into the water (it's happened several times in the past).

A night cat shot is a pure instrument scan where you ingnore your "feel" and rely totally on instruments. For a night cat shot, you put your survival flashlight on your back-up gyro (in case of a gen failure), you set a safe single engine climb attitude (just in case), and you PRAY nothing goes wrong with the jet.

I would argue that a night cat shot is a true 0/0 takeoff (black sky, black water, no horizon, no terrain, no references other than instruments).

For the record, I have landed on an aricraft carrier 802 times. I LOVE the day stuff! It is a blast and I'd pay someone for that type of thrill. Also for the record, I have never, NEVER (ever, ever, ever), enjoyed at night cat or night trap.

USN guys, please chime in--anyone ever enjoy night Ops?

Cheers,
Tumbleweed.
"Afterburner is a great substitute for poor headwork"
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Old 12-16-2007 | 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by ImTumbleweed

USN guys, please chime in--anyone ever enjoy night Ops?

"Afterburner is a great substitute for poor headwork"
To answer that.......NO!

I like your quote! Sounds like something from the school house
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Old 12-16-2007 | 06:29 AM
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Default Wive's Tales

And I thought this was going to be about carrier pilot's wives.
How disappointing.
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Old 12-16-2007 | 08:34 PM
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SaltyDog and Tumbleweed,

Thanks for the explanations! I guess my roommate (Army) knows a thing or two after all! How does the Navy train for cats and traps before tackling the real thing?

Tumbleweed, I like the signature tagline!
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Old 12-16-2007 | 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by BoilerWings
SaltyDog and Tumbleweed,

Thanks for the explanations! I guess my roommate (Army) knows a thing or two after all! How does the Navy train for cats and traps before tackling the real thing?

Tumbleweed, I like the signature tagline!
They dont. You just go do it. The first time you trap at the boat and get a cat shot you are all by your lonesome.........
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Old 12-16-2007 | 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Rocco
They dont. You just go do it. The first time you trap at the boat and get a cat shot you are all by your lonesome.........
And I thought signing a student off for his first solo was nerve racking! I'm pretty sure I'd be hittin' up the local beverage establishment after that...if they even have much/any of that on a carrier...

Are there any traditions to celebrate someone's first cat and trap?
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Old 12-17-2007 | 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by BoilerWings
Are there any traditions to celebrate someone's first cat and trap?
After finding out that they qualified at the Boat, young SNA's usually get drunk at the nearest bar. Preferably in Key West but pretty much anywhere will do.

That’s what I did anyway.
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Old 12-17-2007 | 02:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocco
They dont. You just go do it. The first time you trap at the boat and get a cat shot you are all by your lonesome.........

Not entirely true, the procedures are all taught and briefed through lectures, and simulators(alot of them) for actual ship operations. The landings themselves are practiced(all graded by LSOs) daily before going to the ship. The optical landing systime(fresnel lense aka meatball) are all on the runways in use at our training bases for landing practice so the sight picture is as close as you can get to the ship(mind you its very different at the ship). Rocco is right, when he says the first time you land on the ship and takeoff, you are solo. There is no IP in your backseat. It's pretty amazing if you think about how many hours these guys/gals and what we let them do in these airplanes.
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