Interesting difference in philosophies there. The Navy/Marine Corps tactical jet syllabus teaches each SNA(Student Naval Aviator) the basics in BFM and Strike in addition to the standard FAM(contact), FORM, Instrument skill sets and then makes a decision based on stage performance, total performance, and needs of the respective service(not in that order) in placing aviators into platforms. It's not a perfect system and doesn't always get the square peg in the square hole, but I think in the end the exposure to all mission areas enables the building block approach in the FRS(RTU). This was also done when the choice of aircraft was F-14, F/A-18, AV-8B, EA-6B, and S-3. Now the choices for all SNA's in the T-45TS program is a variant of the Hornet/Superhornet and Hornets/Harriers for our Marine brethren. Certainly JSF will change that a bit but I think either way if we didn't teach those basic skillsets in the Training Command the re-fly rate at the FRS level(increased cost/flight hour) would be much higher, so its win-win for big Navy.

 

Also remmeber that it wasn't all that long ago that the USAF was still sending every UPT student through T-37 and T-38 - then tracking them for Fighter/Attack, Bomber, or Heavies (btw - where do the few helos fit in here now?). AF guys - when did they start tracking into the T-1 program? Early 90s was it? That seems more efficient though it is ashame that everyone doesn't get the chance to fly the T-38.

USMCFLYR

 

Early to Mid-90's. The first S(plit)UPT class was at Reese, around 94 I think. Took a while to propogate through all the training bases. Last UPT class was at Columbus, 97-04. Started Jan '96.

 

AH! I always wondered where the S(UPT) came from - thanks.

USMCFLYR

 

Technically, the S stands for Specialized. Just a FYI.

 

Sorry I misunderstood what you what you meant.
I graduated from the T-1 track with 264hrs, remember that while you fighter guys fly 1-1.5 hrs sorties the T-1 guys are flying 4 hours at a pop(2 studs per sortie generally). So they are graduating with more time.

edit: you know what I am going to have to go back and look at my records again. That 264 might be KC-135 course complete.

 

Also remember before SUPT (T-37 then T-1 or T-38) the Air Force was training a "universal pilot" which ,as It was explained to me, meant that at any time a heavy driver could be assigned to a fighter etc...If you look at Vietnam alot of heavy drivers flew fighters or Sandy's/FACs. We were trained to a certain level and the chips fell where they may on assignment night. The only division of students occurred at the end of the program, where you were told if you were recommended as TTB (Tanker/Transport/Bomber) or FAR (Fighter, Attack, Reconnaissance) those students who were FAR recommended flew a couple of 4-ship formation rides that TTB students didn't. That was the only difference.

 

SUPT bases have a track select at the end of phase 2....your choices are T-38/T-1/T-44/UH-1. The helo guys go to Ft. Rucker. In the old days I believe there was a UPT(H) program where you never flew fixed wing, just went straight helicopters.

ENJJPT guys still all go 38's, just like the old UPT. They are starting to send some guys to other tracks at other bases, but that is on a case by case basis.

 

Same theory, different execution. The difference in AF is that we save the tactical stuff for Introduction to Fighter Fundamentals still flown in the T-38...between UPT and FTU (FRS). The washout rate in that program hovers around 10%. So the real benefit is that if someone washes out because he can't handle the tactical stuff, we still have a dude with wings on his chest...he just goes to a heavy as opposed to the million or so training dollars spent up to that point being wasted. That's also where the "basic skillsets in the training command" before FTU/FRS show up. So when we get a guy to F-15/16/22 or A-10 training, he already has a strong wingman 101 foundation plus practice in all of the basic BFM concepts, etc.

Bottom line, similar training. Ours just throws the tactical stuff into a graduate portion. I realize you push the assignment down the road until after you've seen them perform tactically, and I see the merit in that, but let's face it...who cares if you can be an ace in a T-38. Plus, I think unlike you guys, we have a fragged graduation date that needs to be made, so the T-38 portion of the class needs to finish at the same time as the T-1 (heavy track) dudes. Not enough time to get all of the tactical stuff in before wings.

 

Oh the ever present timeline....